After two losses to Trump, what should the Democratic Party strategy be moving forward?

[Costanza]

Have Democrats learned their lesson? There’s reason for hope.​

By Katrina vanden Heuvel
November 7, 2017

In the run-up to the 2016 election, Sen. Charles E. Schumer (D-N.Y.) dismissed the possibility that Donald Trump's popularity with rural and working-class voters spelled trouble for the Democratic ticket. "For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia," he proclaimed, reflecting the prevailing attitude within the party establishment. "And you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin."

One year after the election, it's not clear that Democrats have learned their lesson. Many have deluded themselves into believing that Russian interference, and not the party's abysmal failure to win over the working class, was the primary culprit in Hillary Clinton's crushing defeat. Clinton herself has pointed fingers at Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) and former FBI director James B. Comey, while mocking former vice president Joe Biden's suggestion that her campaign did not offer a vision for the middle class. But even as Democratic leaders have cleared the wreckage and begun to rebuild, there has not been a full and honest reckoning with what actually happened in 2016 or how the party can avoid the same outcome in the 2018 midterms.

In the absence of an official inquiry, a group of Democratic and progressive activists last week published "Autopsy: The Democratic Party in Crisis." While the 33-page report covers a range of issues, it offers a particularly harsh indictment of the party's self-defeating attempts to simultaneously please its billionaire backers and the working-class voters who make up the Democratic base. "Corporate domination over the party's agenda — and, perhaps more importantly, the perception of corporate control over the party's agenda — rendered the Democrats' messaging on economic issues ideologically rudderless and resulted in a decline in support among working-class people across racial lines," the autopsy states. "We live in a time of unrest and justified cynicism towards those in power; Democrats will not win if they continue to bring a wonk knife to a populist gunfight." ...

If they hope to avoid a repeat of the bludgeoning they suffered in 2016, Democrats will have to work harder to establish a clear, compelling vision of what they are for beyond opposition to Trump. They have to build and expand a cross-class, cross-racial coalition of voters in every part of the country. They have to demonstrate, through action, that they care more about defending the interests of workers than rewarding big donors or winning over supposedly moderate Republicans who have burned them in the past. Trump’s plutocratic agenda is a massive betrayal of the working-class voters who once believed he would fight for them. But it would be a tragic mistake for Democrats to assume, as they did a year ago, that Trump’s shortcomings alone will carry them to victory.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/have-democrats-learned-their-lesson-theres-reason-for-hope/2017/11/07/cab3e78c-c315-11e7-aae0-cb18a8c29c65_story.html

Democrats did not change and history repeated itself.

What needs to change now?

 

[geechiedan]

As everyone fights for their own agenda within the party it's going to difficult to strike a balance.

 

[Costanza]

As everyone fights for their own agenda within the party it's going to difficult to strike a balance.

The real key is ignoring people who use the result as an opportunity to repeat all the same shit they've always believed, rather than learn from it.

This is called "reaffirming prior assumptions." That's not what we need. We need fresh & honest thinking.

An example is conservative Democrats using this as an opportunity to criticize all the shit about "woke" people using pronouns and Latinx, which is an old talking point that has nothing to do with this election.

Two examples-- in the second one, the person literally admits that she is recycling the same shit she has been saying for ten years and that her solution has nothing to do with what Joe Biden and Kamala Harris did:

1.







Kamala and her entire team never used pronouns, she never mentioned her race or gender, never engaged in cancel culture, she highlighted freedom & patriotism, would deflect when asked about race or gender and say "I'm gonna represent all Americans". Stop watching these idiotic cable news hosts, they're part of the problem. Their only answer for decades of failure is to move further right.

2.



“I’m going to speak some hard truths...We are not be party of common sense, which is the message the voters sent to us...When we address Latino voters...as Latinx, for instance, b/c that’s the politically correct thing to do, it makes them think we don’t even live in the same planet as they do. When we are too afraid to say that, hey, college kids, if you're trashing the campus of Columbia University b/c you’re unhappy about some sort of policy and you’re taking over a university and you’re trashing it and preventing other students from learning, that is unacceptable. But we’re so worried about alienating one or another cohort in our coalition that we do not know what to say when normal people look at that and say, wait a second. I send my kids to college so they can learn, not so they can burn buildings and trash lawns, right? And so on and so forth. When we put pronouns after names and say she/her as opposed to saying, you know what, if I call you by the wrong pronoun, call me out. I am sorry. I won't do it again. But stop with the virtue signaling and speak to people like they’re normal. There is nothing that I'm going to say to Shermichael that I’m not going to say to your or I’m not going to say to somebody else. I speak the same language to everybody. But that’s not what Democrats do. We constantly try to parse out different ways of speaking because our focus groups or polling shows that so-and-so appeals to such and such. That’s not how normal people think. It is not common sense and we need to start being the part of common sense again. Joe Biden is not responsible for that, neither is Kamala Harris. That is a problem that Democrats have had for years. I’ve been banging the drum on this for I don’t know how — probably ten years on this. We need to get back to being the party of common sense that people look at us and say we understand you. We appreciate what you say because you speak our language. And, until we do that, we should stop blaming other people for our own mistakes.”

 

[mcguyver]

Mofo, stop making threads.

 

[Costanza]

Mofo, stop making threads.

This is the only thread I've made since the election. Nobody forced you to click.

 

[Mt. Yukon]

Unfortunately they're the grownups in the room. Thats not a compliment in the current political climate. We have a nation that doesn't actually understand government, capitalism, or how world events impact us here. Oh yeah, a bunch of fuckin bigots too. So anything not relating to non white males isn't gonna move the needle in a positive way. The way forward is either... Move further right to meet the populous, or do what you've been doing and hope Trump fucks shit up to the point people come crawling back. The Dems have issues for sure, but they're the only party that's still held to any kind of standard. The right is so fucked up, but no one that matters complains about any of the shit they're bad at, or does wrong... Why??? Because white men still run the country and the Dems are on the wrong side of too many of them.

 

[Costanza]

The real key is ignoring people who use the result as an opportunity to repeat all the same shit they've always believed, rather than learn from it.

This is called "reaffirming prior assumptions." That's not what we need. We need fresh & honest thinking.

Elie Mystal has the right approach.

If everyone can say "The NEW thing I'm learning is: ..." we can have a much more productive conversation.






^^^ This is some really smart shit, worth thinking about.

 

[PsiBorg]

1) Listen to your constituents.
2) Do what you're constituents want you to do, versus doing what the party wants you to do.

 

[roblo]

Democrats need to stop the weirdo shit like pushing transgenderism and stop letting the country be flooded by millions of illegals. Stop the sanctuary city bullshit. Just get back to common sense policies that all Americans can agree on.

 

[Costanza]

Democrats need to stop the weirdo shit like pushing transgenderism and stop letting the country be flooded by millions of illegals. Stop the sanctuary city bullshit. Just get back to common sense policies that all Americans can agree on.

I feel like you are doing what I was just talking about, taking in information and trying to fit that within your already-existing world view.

What did Biden & Harris do on transgenderism and "illegals" to bring on this result?

Maybe you could make a case against Biden's handling of the border but what did they say or do with regard to transgender people to bring this on?
These two issues were the dominant themes in Trump's advertising so it is not invalid to bring them up. But what specifically did they do wrong and what specifically should the next candidate do differently?

 

[Temujin]

Ya'll are making this way to complex. Biden beat trump, Hillary and Kamala didn't. Put any other white man against trump he losses. White men ain't voting for woman or black woman period.

We have never had a female president republican or democrat. This ain't rocket science it's sexism.

 

[mcguyver]

This is the only thread I've made since the election. Nobody forced you to click.

Bullshit

 

[mcguyver]

Ya'll are making this way to complex. Biden beat trump, Hillary and Kamala didn't. Put any other white man against trump he losses. White men ain't voting for woman or black woman period.

We have never had a female president republican or democrat. This ain't rocket science it's sexism.

Mofos are dumb as shit not knowing or paying attention to "MAGA". White folk want their country back.

 

[DJCandle]

Been listening to this for the better part of 10 years now..

Democrats simply don’t understand how detrimental that hijacked “woke” movement and the spotlight on the LGBTQ community was in the global realm. The bathroom debates, the questioning of fetuses and whether they’re sentient or not, the desperate inclusionary rhetoric, all to appease a small percentage of people, while alienating their entire base, much of whom are immigrants or non black and white people.

It’s fine for us as Americans (and not really but we tolerate the fuckery) but for the traditional cultures and traditional immigrants that are needed to win an election? They’re not jiving with that. They WILL throw away every issue on healthcare, women’s right, education, war etc, and revert back to what THEY know. Hispanics, Asian, Arabs, Native Americans, all cooked and shifted to the right the other night. Go out there and talk to them. They will tell you straight from their mouths what they been saying for years now.

People struggling for a raise and you worried about “keeping it PC” cause dogshit cancel culture coming for you. Folks not knowing what their next gig or paycheck is, but gotta respect a man’s right to dress as a woman and go in a ladies bathroom.

It was all BS.

Tuesday was the culmination of that movement and the chickens came home to roost.

For what it’s worth? Bin that shit and move back to center/left politics. End this spotlight on the LGBTQ woke nonsense and start making sense again. Listen to the people who wanna vote for you and focus on the basics cause it don’t matter if you graduated from MIT or Yale.. you need their vote in order to win.

Less debating, more relating.

 

[roblo]

I feel like you are doing what I was just talking about, taking in information and trying to fit that within your already-existing world view.

What did Biden & Harris do on transgenderism and "illegals" to bring on this result?

Maybe you could make a case against Biden's handling of the border but what did they say or do with regard to transgender people to bring this on?
These two issues were the dominant themes in Trump's advertising so it is not invalid to bring them up. But what specifically did they do wrong and what specifically should the next candidate do differently?

I don't even have to get into any details about illegal immigration after the democrats let in at least 10 million "immigrants" during the last four years. What the "democrats" did was pass a bill in the house that would've engrained transgenderism into the federal law. A tranny would have every right as a real woman. Men playing women's sports, men in women's locker rooms, bathrooms, everything. A tranny would be no different from your mom or wife under the law. They didn't have the votes to pass in the Senate so it didn't become law. Joe Biden urged congress to pass it. So "specifically" the democrats could enforce immigration laws and act like coming into the country illegally is a big deal and they can "specifically" stop trying to change the definition of a woman. We've known what a woman is for thousands of years but now democrats want it to be based on feelings. Fuck that nonsense. Both my sisters live in California and are super Trump haters but voted for a republican for the first time in their lives and both of these issues were prominent in their decision. This is how you lose the electoral college and the popular vote.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/5

 

[Curtwalk]

They are too arrogant to get a new strategy. They figured Biden would easily defeat any Republican outside of Trump.
They didn’t think Trump would run again so they had no incentive to actually do anything the last four years.
Since Trump can’t run in 2028 they not gonna change , they’ll just chalk it up to a bad matchup and keep it moving.

 

[RoadRage]

Get back to the issues, stop trying to be popular (over relying on celebrities) get back to the party core, which means fighting for the working class, especially black workers. Stop it with the gay agenda crap! Have a real strategy to build up the working class, and admit something has to be done with crime and the immigration influx. And stop trying to out bull shit Trump and the republicans!

 

[darth frosty]

 

[Temujin]

Get back to the issues, stop trying to be popular (over relying on celebrities) get back to the party core, which means fighting for the working class, especially black workers. Stop it with the gay agenda crap! Have a real strategy to build up the working class, and admit something has to be done with crime and the immigration influx. And stop trying to out bull shit Trump and the republicans!

Aint shit change about the democratic party since Obama. The only common variable with the losses is the most obvious one they were both women. The last 16 years there has been a republican president for 4. Let's not go crazy. This is the same bullshit crime and immigration the Repubs have been running since the 70's. The platform doesn't need to change the candidate needs to change.

 

[Costanza]

It’s crazy that people respond with things like “Stop it with the gay agenda crap!”

That’s just something you care about, that’s not why they lost to Trump.

The question is not “what would make the Democratic Party perfect for you?” The question is what do they need to change to WIN.

 

[Costanza]

Aint shit change about the democratic party since Obama. The only common variable with the losses is the most obvious one they were both women. The last 16 years there has been a republican president for 4. Let's not go crazy. This is the same bullshit crime and immigration the Repubs have been running since the 70's. The platform doesn't need to change the candidate needs to change.

I think this is wrong but it’s a valid answer IMO.

I think other women could have won in 2016 or 2024 and men could have lost in 2016, 2020 and 2024. What matters is the platform, IMO.

 

[^SpiderMan^]

They should run a moderate. Completely drop the Trans support, and drop all LBGTQ stuff with kids and schools. Keep supporting gay marriage and abortions because those are key issues for a lot of Democratic supporters. I would really hope that he would have tangible support for Black folks including Reparations, but he doesn’t really need to because the Black vote is easy to get for a Democrat.

 

[Lexx Diamond]

Stop catering to faggots and Hispanics.

 

[Supersav]

They should run a moderate. Completely drop the Trans support, and drop all LBGTQ stuff with kids and schools. Keep supporting gay marriage and abortions because those are key issues for a lot of Democratic supporters. I would really hope that he would have tangible support for Black folks including Reparations, but he doesn’t really need to because the Black vote is easy to get for a Democrat.

Well according to @code_pirahna black people don't get anything because they don't demand anything lol

 

[geechiedan]

They should run a moderate. Completely drop the Trans support, and drop all LBGTQ stuff with kids and schools. Keep supporting gay marriage and abortions because those are key issues for a lot of Democratic supporters. I would really hope that he would have tangible support for Black folks including Reparations, but he doesn’t really need to because the Black vote is easy to get for a Democrat.

dude we need to be honest with ourselves and real here...no one is signing off on 20 trillion dollars for one group. its a non starter especially in this maga era. Come 2028 NO democratic president is going to stand in front of the country and say we need to give these people 20 TRILLION dollars in reparations and expect hispanics and asians and native americans to stand in solidarity on that.

 

[^SpiderMan^]

dude we need to be honest with ourselves and real here...no one is signing off on 20 trillion dollars for one group. its a non starter especially in this maga era. Come 2028 NO democratic president is going to stand in front of the country and say we need to give these people 20 TRILLION dollars in reparations and expect hispanics and asians and native americans to stand in solidarity on that.

We kind of agree. I interpreted the question was what kind of Democrat Candidate would have the best chance of winning. Even though I would prefer him to fight for Reparations, he doesn’t have to because it wont make a big positive difference in votes.

 

[mariano42]

Go younger. Both parties are old as fuck holding to power. Millenials and Gen Z need to take over.

 

[Costanza]

Stop catering to faggots and Hispanics.

As I said in another response- “That’s just something you care about, that’s not why they lost to Trump.”

They probably should “cater” or reach out to Hispanics as much or more, they just clearly didn’t do it effectively.

The answer to an election loss isn’t ignoring more people.

 

[Costanza]

They should run a moderate. Completely drop the Trans support, and drop all LBGTQ stuff with kids and schools.

I think this is a cultural critique, not a political critique of the most recent campaign.

What LGBTQ stuff did Harris or Biden campaign on that you think they should not have?

 

[mcguyver]

As I said in another response- “That’s just something you care about, that’s not why they lost to Trump.”

They probably should “cater” or reach out to Hispanics as much or more, they just clearly didn’t do it effectively.

The answer to an election loss isn’t ignoring more people.

A Hispanic would say this.

 

[Costanza]

Go younger. Both parties are old as fuck holding to power. Millenials and Gen Z need to take over.

Harris was out there saying she represents a new generation.

I was like “You are 3 years younger than Obama! He was elected 16 years ago!!!”

 

[Costanza]

A Hispanic would say this.

I’ve been posting here for 20 years. I’m not Hispanic.

Someone who wants Democrats to win elections would say that.

 

[Costanza]

There is data suggesting the Harris emphasis on reaching out to Republicans was a failure:

 

[eagle force]

They are too arrogant to get a new strategy. They figured Biden would easily defeat any Republican outside of Trump.
They didn’t think Trump would run again so they had no incentive to actually do anything the last four years.
Since Trump can’t run in 2028 they not gonna change , they’ll just chalk it up to a bad matchup and keep it moving.

that and the democrats constant belittling of their voter base

 

[eagle force]

dude we need to be honest with ourselves and real here...no one is signing off on 20 trillion dollars for one group. its a non starter especially in this maga era. Come 2028 NO democratic president is going to stand in front of the country and say we need to give these people 20 TRILLION dollars in reparations and expect hispanics and asians and native americans to stand in solidarity on that.

which is why we'll either sit out and vote republican/independent again in 2028

 

[Costanza]