Basketball Mt. Rushmore

[massdagod]

But that help never won a championship without him. And let's not forget the one he won in Milwaukee when all he had was an old Oscar Robinson with him. And dude lets not get it twisted, Jordan does not compare to Russell, Wilt or Jabbar. Russell has more rings, Wilt average 50 for a season & Kareem is the greatest scorer in league history! Hell even Oscar averaged a triple double for a season. Jordan can't fuck with any of them! Jordan is the greatest player in the ESPN era, that's it.

As an individual player, Jordan is far greater than the 4 you mentioned above.

Outside of Kareem (mid to end of career), Wilt, Russell and Oscar had inflated stats.

If you break down the numbers:

(WC 61/62) 50ppg in a season where his team averaged 126ppg averaging a pace of 131 possessions in a game.

VS

(MJ 86/87) 37ppg in a season where his team averaged 104ppg averaging a pace of 95 possessions in a game.


Jordan's season is Far more impressive. That's a Fact.

Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell's
rebounding is also inflated.. If u look at rebounding percentages and break it down, Wilt and Russell's career 19.9% and 18.7% rebound percentage would be equivalent to around 12-13 rebounds a game in the modern NBA.

This is why Dennis Rodman is the greatest rebounder Ever. because his career average of 23.6% of available rebounds is by far better than everyone else's.

Oscar in the modern NBA wouldn't averaged anything close to a triple double.. In fact, his averages in the modern NBA if you broke them down averages to Prime Grant Hill Averages.


There's a reason why Oscar Robertson spent most of his career on Losing team and/or teams that didn't even make the playoffs. Because if you broke Oscar Robertson's numbers down, you pretty much get Grant Hill Results. Fact.


Ok, he was the only player to average a Triple double... They don't tell you that he averaged that in a league that averaged 25-30 points per game more, 35 to 40 possessions more and close to 30% more rebounding opportunities due to the fact that they shot much more and missed a lot more shots, with team literally averaging in the 30-percentile area in Field Goal percentage...

Everything I stated is Facts.

If you want to allow modern day NBA players to play in the years of inflated numbers the you would have to know this:

Michael Jordan would have averaged over 50ppg in a season twice.
Kobe Bryant would have averaged over 50PPG in a season once.

In an "inflated" statistical NBA, if his career would have been from the mid-late 50's to the early 70's, Michael Jordan would have a far better scoring average (regular and post season) PPG average than he had and he already leads in NBA history.

Michael Jordan would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Lebron James would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Jason Kidd would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 5 times.

Dennis Rodman would have averaged over 30 rebounds in a season at least 5 times.


Since we are on the Subject of stats:

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

 

[DAHITMAN]

1. MICHAEL JORDAN
2. Lebron James
3. Kobe Bryant
4. Tim Duncan
5. Hakeem the Dream

 

[geechiedan]

you canNOT have a mt rushmore like list and NOT have bill russell on it PERIOD..

11 championships...coach/player during the 5th most worst time to be black and living in america..if russell is NOT on your list then you don't know american history

 

[KingTaharqa]

s an individual player, Jordan did far greater than the 4 you mentioned above.

False. No rules changes were instituted to stop Jordan. The game today was shaped from the Rules changes made to stop Wilt. Jordan doesnt have the kind of impact on the game at all. Jordan also has 5 less rings than Russell, and 6 less Finals appearances. He wasnt that kind of winner at all.

Outside of Kareem (mid to end of career), Wilt, Russell and Oscar had inflated stats.

Bullshit. Their stats are on par with the players of their era. Manipulating their numbers to a different game 40 years later is weak. Someone could do the same thing to your precious Jordan 30 years from now. The "pace" is slower than those 110 points a game contest he was playing in the late 80s. His scoring was "inflated" due to opportunities and the run & gun style of the league. See, anybody can do that.

If you break down the numbers:

(WC 61/62) 50ppg in a season where his team averaged 126ppg averaging a pace of 131 possessions in a game.

VS

(MJ 86/87) 37ppg in a season where his team averaged 104ppg averaging a pace of 95 possessions in a game.


Jordan's season is Far more impressive. That's a Fact.

You are the only person on the planet that thinks any season of Jordan compares to Wilts 62 season.

Wilt led the league in points, rebounds, minutes, was 2nd in FG% at 50%. His team lost in the 2nd round of the playoffs that year in a Game 7 to Russell and the Celtics. In Jordan's 87 season he got swept out of the first round by Larry Bird & the Celtics.

Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell's
rebounding is also inflated.. If u look at rebounding percentages and break it down, Wilt and Russell's career 19.9% and 18.7% rebound percentage would be equivalent to around 12-13 rebounds a game in the modern NBA.

CACs normally go to "percentage" when totals and averages don't play to their favor.

This is why Dennis Rodman is the greatest rebounder Ever. because his career average of 23.6% of available rebounds is by far better than everyone else's.

Pull up 1 NBA historical source that credits Rodman as the greatest rebounder ever. Wilt Chamberlain holds the records for most career rebounds, most rebounds in a season, most rebounds in a game, and most rebounds in a playoff game. You are the only person I've ever seen call Dennis Rodman the greatest rebounder ever. Wilt grabbed more boards in his next to last season at 35 than Rodman ever did in any year.

Oscar in the modern NBA wouldn't averaged anything close to a triple double.. In fact, his averages in the modern NBA if you broke them down averages to Prime Grant Hill Averages.

This is all opinion. Its like me saying Jordan wouldnt've got the touches or averaged 30 points a game if he had been drafted by the Lakers or Celtics.

There's a reason why Oscar Robertson spent most of his career on Losing team and/or teams that didn't even make the playoffs. Because if you broke Oscar Robertson's numbers down, you pretty much get Grant Hill Results. Fact.

Without using google, tell me Oscars 3 best teammates on the Cincinatti Royals. Oscar playing with scrubs fared better than MJ who has 1 playoff win without Scottie Pippen, and never won a playoff series. MJ never had a winning season on the Bulls or Wizards without Pip either, straight sub .500 basketball as the "only guy".

Ok, he was the only player to average a Triple double... They don't tell you that he averaged that in a league that averaged 25-30 points per game more, 35 to 40 possessions more and close to 30% more rebounding opportunities due to the fact that they shot much more and missed a lot more shots, with team literally averaging in the 30-percentile area in Field Goal percentage...

If it was so easy to do back then, why is he the only 1? If 50 points a game was so easy back then, why is Wilt the only 1? If 100 points is so easy why is Wilt the only 1 to do it and no one else has come close? Has Jordan ever scored 100 points in a regulation game on any level (jr,high, high school, college)? I don't think so, no matter who his competition was.

Everything I stated is Facts.

Hardly.

If you want to allow modern day NBA players to play in the years of inflated numbers the you would have to know this:

Michael Jordan would have averaged over 50ppg in a season twice.
Kobe Bryant would have averaged over 50PPG in a season once.

And what is this based off of? Have those 2 ever averaged that much on any level? Jr. High? High School? College? Have those 2 ever played every minute of every game including OTs in a season before? On any level? Didnt think so.

Michael Jordan would have a far better scoring average (regular and post season) PPG average than he had and he already leads in NBA history.

Not playing in the racist 50's and 60's he wouldnt. Jordan doesnt have the stamina nor would he be able to play the minutes to have a season like that. There's only 1 Wilt, and that's why its only happened ONCE in history.

Michael Jordan would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Lebron James would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Jason Kidd would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 5 times.

Dennis Rodman would have averaged over 30 rebounds in a season at least 5 times.

Blah, blah, blah. No facts, just opinion.

Since we are on the Subject of stats:

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history.

Jordan also holds the record for most seasons leading in shot attempts regular season and playoff. He led the league in shot attempts 9 straight years, and led the playoffs almost every time he appeared. Now tell me how many times did he lead the league or playoffs in shooting efficiency? 0. When you're shooting almost 6 more shots a game than the next person on the list you should lead the league in scoring. When you're averaging over 25 shots a game, you should score over 30. For perspective, LeBron averages 16 shots a game this season and is considered the league's best players. If Jordan took 16 shots a game, he'd be just another guard.

(compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)

This has been discussed ad nausem. Wilt plays center and spent most of his years in the playoffs as a Sixer and Laker where he was a defensive anchor. Wilt still holds the record for most points in a playoff game by a rookie (56), and his 58 points another year is the 3rd highest playoff scoring output behind Michael Jordan & Elgin Baylor.

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.

He has the most attempts as well. Where does his FG% rank in NBA Finals history? Any other categories he flourish in like Wilt and Russell? He ever grab 30 rebounds in a Finals game? Didnt think so.

Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Only because PER was not created until the mid 80s long after Wilt & Russell played. PER rewards players for 3 point shots, blocks, and steals, all categories that did not exist in Wilt & Russell's time, so essentially ever player in their eras PERs should be higher. It is a a flawed stat created by a "ESPN guy" during the Jordan era. Nuff said.

Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

See above.

Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Meaningless stats.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Hey guy, you do realize the DPOY and all defensive teams were created BECAUSE of Wilt & Russell. Neither existed when they played, so pointing that fact out is idiocy. DPOY didnt exist until the early 80s, Sidney Moncrief won the first 2 (guess that makes him a better perimeter defender than Jordan). This is why learning ALL NBA history and not just David Stern's tenure is important.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Whoopty do. Outside of scoring and playing passing lanes his contributions are minimal. No efficiency awards. No rebounding titles. No Finals wins over a HOF or even all star center UNLIKE Wilt & Russell who had to go thru each other to win chips.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.

Not every player's ONLY contribution is scoring. Wilt won the 67 Finals as the 4th leading scorer of his team, but had 1 of the most dominant Finals performances ever and that team is considered 1 of the greatest ever. Jordan is a shooting guard, his job was to score, in basketball that is no that the case for other positions. So using SCORING ONLY to dictate a players worth is well, silly. It's like someone knocking Cam Newton for having less rushing yards than AP.

Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

Bullshit. Dude dominated 1 thing, shot taking, and point scoring. 0 rebounding titles, 0 assist titles, 0 efficiency titles. Wilt has 7 scoring titles, 11 rebounding titles, 1 assist title, and 9 shooting efficiency titles. 30 PPG,23 RPG, & 4 APG shits on 30 PPG ,6 RPG, & 5 APG for a career.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple time.

They faced better competition. Wilt & Russell ONLY lost playoff series to other HOF centers or each other. And lets not act like Jordan didnt choke away a 2-1 series lead in '89 to the Pistons. And he had a history of folding in elimination games in the first wave of his career.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.

Because he didnt play nobody. Not 1 team he beat is considered 1 of the greatest. Not 1 HOF center or all star center did he face in the Finals. Vlade, Kevin Duckworth, Mark West, Ervin Johnson, Greg Ostertag twice? In the 80's when real centers like Kareem, Malone, Parrish, Olajuwon, etc were making the Finals were was Jordan? It's not a coincidence he didnt DOMINATE until league expansion in the 90's. The league watered the teams down.

And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

Shoe sales and being a corporate whore makes you the best? I guess Vanilla Ice and Eminem are the GOAT rappers then.

 

[Upgrade Dave]

I didn't know we were going in this direction but okay


Russell>>>Jordan
based off one thing
the NBA made rules to stop Russell but made rules to help Jordan.

 

[Mr.9mm]

My list:
Air - to much including the fact he had the least all-star teammates. Became successful by being the obvious catalyst with sub-par to average teammates aside from Pippen & Rodman. Virtually unstoppable. What separates him from Wilt is he was able to practically take the same quality of talent to two separate dynasties after retiring for a year and half between the two. All this while being in a very competitive & talented era.

Wilt - outstanding talent mixed with opportunity = sheer dominance. The era did not have many players over 6-9 let alone any other 7 footers, but he dominated as someone with his talent should. Greatness excels at any level, but to become legendary depends on how much greater you are from your respective peers. *Only reason Bill Russell is not here is because as legendary & successful as he was individually, the talent of his teammates were greater which equated to more rings for him. He was arguably the best player of his generation on his team with the greatest teammates. Kareem is another strong consideration/alternate.

Oscar Rob - Simply put you don't average a triple-double for an entire season by luck. His placement here is for the same reason as Wilt's. He may have only one championship, but that is more on his teammates. They should step their game's up. Again that is what makes Jordan better that despite his teammates & fortunate for a new coaching change he was able to excel. Kareem could have gone here too.

Magic - 6-8 pg. All time assist per game leader. His court vision & passing was unique. He basically commanded a triple-double when he wanted it & controlled the pace of the game. Overall the first of his kind.

 

[bgque12]

My list:
Air - to much including the fact he had the least all-star teammates. Became successful by being the obvious catalyst with sub-par to average teammates aside from Pippen & Rodman. Virtually unstoppable. What separates him from Wilt is he was able to practically take the same quality of talent to two separate dynasties after retiring for a year and half between the two. All this while being in a very competitive & talented era.

Wilt - outstanding talent mixed with opportunity = sheer dominance. The era did not have many players over 6-9 let alone any other 7 footers, but he dominated as someone with his talent should. Greatness excels at any level, but to become legendary depends on how much greater you are from your respective peers. *Only reason Bill Russell is not here is because as legendary & successful as he was individually, the talent of his teammates were greater which equated to more rings for him. He was arguably the best player of his generation on his team with the greatest teammates. Kareem is another strong consideration/alternate.

Oscar Rob - Simply put you don't average a triple-double for an entire season by luck. His placement here is for the same reason as Wilt's. He may have only one championship, but that is more on his teammates. They should step their game's up. Again that is what makes Jordan better that despite his teammates & fortunate for a new coaching change he was able to excel. Kareem could have gone here too.

Magic - 6-8 pg. All time assist per game leader. His court vision & passing was unique. He basically commanded a triple-double when he wanted it & controlled the pace of the game. Overall the first of his kind.

So the all time scoring leader in the history of he games doesn't make the list?

 

[KingTaharqa]

I didn't know we were going in this direction but okay


Russell>>>Jordan
based off one thing
the NBA made rules to stop Russell but made rules to help Jordan.

Massdagod will call Wilt & Russells' numbers "inflated" due to pace and tell you they should be and would be lower if they played today. Yet he doesnt do that for Jordan's stats from 20 years ago. The game's pace is much slower, teams hold the ball longer and score less making less opportunities to jack shots. But Massdagod will tell you Jordan would average 40 today in this "soft league". Thats the kind of inconsistency that hurts the credibility of his arguments.

 

[kain]

I know a lot of folks like the stats. I like players who go heads up with each other to define the best. I seen guys play organized ball but can't do shit in streetball. Tiny Archibald played top in both. Real ball players can play anywhere against anybody. Not knocking the NBA but the ABA & other leagues showcase head to head play.

Joe "The Destroyer" Collins was legend.
Wilt asked the NBA to draft Collins but he turned it down.
Drugs fucked his life up but ask those who played him about his level of play. He barely edges the Goat out to be tops, JMHO.

 

[massdagod]

Massdagod will call Wilt & Russells' numbers "inflated" due to pace and tell you they should be and would be lower if they played today. Yet he doesnt do that for Jordan's stats from 20 years ago. The game's pace is much slower, teams hold the ball longer and score less making less opportunities to jack shots. But Massdagod will tell you Jordan would average 40 today in this "soft league". Thats the kind of inconsistency that hurts the credibility of his arguments.

Michael Jordan's Bulls team from 20 Years ago averaged 92-93 possessions a game. (92.5 to be exact)

Possessions a game in 2014 is 94.0 possessions per game on the Dot...

the Average possession is Higher than Michael Jordan's Bulls of 20 years ago...

But You aint know that... That pretty much Kills your Own Arguement.

The year Michael Jordan averaged 37.1ppg, his team averaged 95 possession per game... They would be 10th in the League Today.

Fact.

Kill'm With Facts.





Man Lie, women Lie, Numbers Don't. Jordan = GOAT










Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

 

[bgque12]

This is why I never but MJ in the top 5 players. The "greatest" players didn't need help from the refs.

 

[Complex]

Queen Tariyaki is probably the only person who didn't vote for Mike

 

[Mr.9mm]

So the all time scoring leader in the history of he games doesn't make the list?

Nah I think he or Russell can be substituted for Wilt or Oscar. Only problem there's only room for 4. If it was 5-6 both would in there. Even though he is the all time scoring leader, that's a cumulative stat. For me it's dominance vs accumulations. They both changed their games to accommodate other stars so they could win a championship, Wilt earlier in his career than Kareem. Eg. Emmitt Smith may be the nfl all time rush yards leader, but many don't consider him to be the greatest running back. He was great & played long enough. Personally I'll take Barry over every one s else, but that's for another thread.

 

[KingTaharqa]

The year Michael Jordan averaged 37.1ppg, his team averaged 95 possession per game... They would be 10th in the League Today.

Fact.

The league average in '87 was 100.8, much higher than the 94.0 today. Today half the teams in the league average over 100 points a game, in '87 EVERY team in the league did. This year no team is averaging over 110 points a game. In '87, 12 different teams averaged over 110 points a contest. So as you can see, SCORING WAS VERY INFLATED THAT SEASON. Jordan would not come close to 37 points per game in today's game because the pace is much slower. See I can do it too!!!

In '93 he averaged 32.6 points per game on almost 26 shots a game at 49.5%. Today's MVP Kevin Durant averages 31.5 points per game on only 20 shots a game at 51.5%. He also grabs more boards, dishes as many assists, and shoots MUCH better from distance and slightly better from the stripe. His PER is much higher as well. You claim team possessions per game are basically the same that year as they are today, if thats the case, we see once again Jordan would NOT stand out like that. There were no Durants or LeBrons in the 90s. His level of competition was weak at his peak.

 

[Brother Blues]

Oh shit....I forgot Oscar.

Mt.Rushmore will have to be more than 4,more like 7....

 

[KingTaharqa]

Queen Tariyaki is probably the only person who didn't vote for Mike

Another Kobe one day/Jordan the next stan speaks.

I gave Jordan a vote, put him in my top 5 all time, and have in my starting 5 all time. The fact is, some of you guys are bitches and think just because you been buying Mike's shoes all your life he is impeccable and without peers on the basketball court. He don't got the best stats, he don't got the most rings, get over this "if you criticize Jordan or dont think he's the GOAT you're a hater" mentality maam.

 

[Upgrade Dave]

Another Kobe one day/Jordan the next stan speaks.

I gave Jordan a vote, put him in my top 5 all time, and have in my starting 5 all time. The fact is, some of you guys are bitches and think just because you been buying Mike's shoes all your life he is impeccable and without peers on the basketball court. He don't got the best stats, he don't got the most rings, get over this "if you criticize Jordan or dont think he's the GOAT you're a hater" mentality maam.

Especially since when the "Jordan vs Lebron" debate starts, the argument is "Jordan has 6 rings". Well, Russell has more rings than fingers.

 

[massdagod]

The league average in '87 was 100.8, much higher than the 94.0 today.

Stop Right there.


In 86-87, Michael Jordan's Bulls averaged 95.8 possessions a Game.

Wilt Chamberlain meaningless 61-62 regular season averaged 50.4 points in 131.1 possessions in 48.5 minutes.
The GOATS meaningless 86-87 regular season averaged 37.1 points in 95.8 possessions in 40.0 minutes.

If the 86-87 GOAT game averaged 131.1 possession per game, he would have averaged 52.9 points per game...

If the 86-87 GOAT played 48.5 minutes in the same season of 131.1 possessions per game, he would have averaged 63.4 points per game...

Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell's
rebounding is also inflated.. If u look at rebounding percentages and break it down, Wilt and Russell's career 19.9% and 18.7% rebound percentage would be equivalent to around 12-13 rebounds a game in the modern NBA.

This is why Dennis Rodman is the greatest rebounder Ever. because his career average of 23.6% of available rebounds is by far better than everyone else's.

Oscar in the modern NBA wouldn't averaged anything close to a triple double.. In fact, his averages in the modern NBA if you broke them down averages to Prime Grant Hill Averages.


There's a reason why Oscar Robertson spent most of his career on Losing team and/or teams that didn't even make the playoffs. Because if you broke Oscar Robertson's numbers down, you pretty much get Grant Hill Results. Fact.


Ok, he was the only player to average a Triple double... They don't tell you that he averaged that in a league that averaged 25-30 points per game more, 35 to 40 possessions more and close to 30% more rebounding opportunities due to the fact that they shot much more and missed a lot more shots, with team literally averaging in the 30-percentile area in Field Goal percentage...

Everything I stated is Facts.

If you want to allow modern day NBA players to play in the years of inflated numbers the you would have to know this:

Michael Jordan would have averaged over 50ppg in a season twice.
Kobe Bryant would have averaged over 50PPG in a season once.

In an "inflated" statistical NBA, if his career would have been from the mid-late 50's to the early 70's, Michael Jordan would have a far better scoring average (regular and post season) PPG average than he had and he already leads in NBA history.

Michael Jordan would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Lebron James would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Jason Kidd would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 5 times.

Dennis Rodman would have averaged over 30 rebounds in a season at least 5 times.


Since we are on the Subject of stats:

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And did it with Much less talented teams than other Legends I might add; especially during his 1st 3-Peat.

And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

Kill'm With Facts.





Man Lie. Women Lie. Numbers Don't. Jordan = GOAT

 

[itzmotto]

Kobe with Only five votes Bgol got no love for the Mamna!!

 

[KingTaharqa]

Massdagod in 1987, Michael Jordan averaged almost 28 shots per game. Charles Oakley, I repeat, Charles Oakley was his team's 2nd leading scorer and shot taker at under 13 shots a game. Jordan was straight chucking that year no question regardless of how many team possesions they had. He took over 8 more shots a game than Durant is this year leading the league in scoring. When Kobe does that, or AI does that, its OK to call them "chuckers". But just cause you skipped school to buy some J's back in the day you hesitate with MJ.

And it aint like he led his team in assists, rebounds, & FG% that year neither (a la LeBron, Durant). And then you got swept out the first round? And you got the gall to say that season is better than Wilt's 62 season where he averaged 50.1 points a game on 50.6% shooting, 25.7 rebounds in 48.5 minutes per game?

 

[knightmelodic]

I'm glad KingTaharqa blew that shit up before I had to.

one thing nobody has mentioned: HOW MANY TEAMS WERE THERE? with all the teams nowadays the talent is definitely watered down.

 

[Dragonfly Jones]

I want Kareem on there but usually for Mt. Rushmore you need your founders. I put Russell, Wilt, Magic, and Jordan on there. Bird, Kareem, Oscar all deserve to be included on there. There should just be a Mt. NBA where you put your 5 out there. I'd have Kareem, Duncan, Bird, Jordan, and Magic.

 

[bgque12]

As an individual player, Jordan is far greater than the 4 you mentioned above.

Outside of Kareem (mid to end of career), Wilt, Russell and Oscar had inflated stats.

If you break down the numbers:

(WC 61/62) 50ppg in a season where his team averaged 126ppg averaging a pace of 131 possessions in a game.

VS

(MJ 86/87) 37ppg in a season where his team averaged 104ppg averaging a pace of 95 possessions in a game.


Jordan's season is Far more impressive. That's a Fact.

Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell's
rebounding is also inflated.. If u look at rebounding percentages and break it down, Wilt and Russell's career 19.9% and 18.7% rebound percentage would be equivalent to around 12-13 rebounds a game in the modern NBA.

This is why Dennis Rodman is the greatest rebounder Ever. because his career average of 23.6% of available rebounds is by far better than everyone else's.

Oscar in the modern NBA wouldn't averaged anything close to a triple double.. In fact, his averages in the modern NBA if you broke them down averages to Prime Grant Hill Averages.


There's a reason why Oscar Robertson spent most of his career on Losing team and/or teams that didn't even make the playoffs. Because if you broke Oscar Robertson's numbers down, you pretty much get Grant Hill Results. Fact.


Ok, he was the only player to average a Triple double... They don't tell you that he averaged that in a league that averaged 25-30 points per game more, 35 to 40 possessions more and close to 30% more rebounding opportunities due to the fact that they shot much more and missed a lot more shots, with team literally averaging in the 30-percentile area in Field Goal percentage...

Everything I stated is Facts.

If you want to allow modern day NBA players to play in the years of inflated numbers the you would have to know this:

Michael Jordan would have averaged over 50ppg in a season twice.
Kobe Bryant would have averaged over 50PPG in a season once.

In an "inflated" statistical NBA, if his career would have been from the mid-late 50's to the early 70's, Michael Jordan would have a far better scoring average (regular and post season) PPG average than he had and he already leads in NBA history.

Michael Jordan would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Lebron James would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Jason Kidd would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 5 times.

Dennis Rodman would have averaged over 30 rebounds in a season at least 5 times.


Since we are on the Subject of stats:

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.







[/QUOTE







With al that BS you just typed, the refs and the league allowed him to get away wait walks damn near everything he drove to the basket and his signature shot of his career to win a championship was a blatant offensive foul. Russell is the greatest winner. Jabbar is the greatest scorer, Wilt is just Wilt. The most dominant to ever play.

 

[D'Evils]

Is this the NBA's Mt. Rushmore or Basketball's?

If you combine winning at the Amateur (High School, College, Olympics) & Professional (NBA)levels these are my finalist.

Russell 4/4 (11 NBA Titles and 2 as Player Coach)
Wilt 3/4 (No Olympics)
Big O 3/4 (No College but was the NCAA all time leading scorer)
Kareem 3/4 (Boycotted '68 Olympics)
Dr. J 1/4 (Only NBA)(2 ABA Titles)
Magic 4/4 (9 NBA finals in 12 years)
Bird 2/4 (No High School or College beat Magic)
Jordan 3/4 (No High School)(6-0 Finals, No game 7s)
Shaq 3/4 (No College)
Duncan 1/4 (Only NBA)
Kobe 2/4 (No High School, Skipped College)
LeBorn 3/4 (Skipped College)

And fuck that I'm choosing 5 not 4
Wilt
Russell
Kareem
Magic
Jordan

 

[mad_bomber]

Kareem

Magic

Jordan

????

 

[Art Vandelay]

BGOL says Jordan, Johnson, Russell and Chamberlain pretty resoundingly, with only Kareem Abdul-Jabbar in shouting distance.

Surprised Dr. J didn't even get a write-in vote. The only write-in was for Joe Hammond.

Michael Jordan
62:

ak_rep, Art Vandelay, BigSmooth, bj4197, Brother Blues, Bru-Ti-Kus, BSmoove201, chrislee, Coldchi, Complex, D'Evils, Daddy Warbuck$, DAHITMAN, daman200, dasmybikepunk, dime bag, Dragonfly Jones, Fuzzy_McNut, gdubs, Gemini, gotay, HeathCliff, HUNTSVEGAZ, i-moses, itzmotto, jayjay2, jduck, jericho999, jrsysfnst1, jucrlgood, kingofkings, KingTaharqa, kmdiaopm, knightmelodic, KW13537, Kwame Coltrane, L.DUBBLE, Lastdayz, massdagod, mrrayda, nycbluenoon, papi68, PDQ21, prose00, Riggz, RoadRage, robmob, sandman65, SHIN-TRAIVONUS, sillyme, teeman, TimRock, Tripster, TurboDerek, Upgrade Dave, Van Allen, weebay, wiZe, xbootsey, xcluesiv, yaBoi, yeahman727
95.38%

Magic Johnson
49:
ak_rep, Art Vandelay, BigSmooth, bj4197, Brother Blues, BSmoove201, CANTBANDASTROKEMAN, chrislee, Coldchi, Complex, daman200, dime bag, Dragonfly Jones, Fuzzy_McNut, gdubs, Gemini, gotay, HeathCliff, HUNTSVEGAZ, i-moses, itzmotto, jayjay2, jduck, jericho999, jrsysfnst1, jucrlgood, kingofkings, kmdiaopm, KW13537, Kwame Coltrane, L.DUBBLE, Lastdayz, mrrayda, nycbluenoon, papi68, Riggz, RoadRage, sandman65, SHIN-TRAIVONUS, sillyme, teeman, TimRock, TurboDerek, Upgrade Dave, weebay, wiZe, xbootsey, xcluesiv, yaBoi
75.38%

Bill Russell
34:
ak_rep, Art Vandelay, Brother Blues, BSmoove201, CANTBANDASTROKEMAN, Complex, D'Evils, daman200, dasmybikepunk, dime bag, dlj11166, Dragonfly Jones, Gemini, gotay, HeathCliff, jrsysfnst1, kingofkings, KingTaharqa, kmdiaopm, knightmelodic, KW13537, L.DUBBLE, mrrayda, nycbluenoon, prose00, Riggz, RoadRage, Tripster, Upgrade Dave, Van Allen, weebay, xcluesiv, yaBoi, yeahman727
52.31%

Wilt Chamberlain
27:
BigSmooth, bj4197, Brother Blues, CANTBANDASTROKEMAN, Complex, D'Evils, daman200, dasmybikepunk, dime bag, dlj11166, Dragonfly Jones, Gemini, gotay, itzmotto, jayjay2, KingTaharqa, knightmelodic, L.DUBBLE, nycbluenoon, prose00, robmob, sandman65, SHIN-TRAIVONUS, Tripster, TurboDerek, Van Allen, wiZe
41.54%

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
21:
Art Vandelay, Bru-Ti-Kus, BSmoove201, CANTBANDASTROKEMAN, chrislee, Coldchi, dasmybikepunk, HeathCliff, i-moses, jduck, KingTaharqa, Kwame Coltrane, Lastdayz, PDQ21, prose00, robmob, sillyme, teeman, Tripster, Upgrade Dave, Van Allen
32.31%

LeBron James
15:
bj4197, Daddy Warbuck$, DAHITMAN, gdubs, HUNTSVEGAZ, itzmotto, jduck, jrsysfnst1, jucrlgood, kingofkings, PDQ21, RoadRage, robmob, sillyme, xbootsey
23.08%

Oscar Robertson
13:
Coldchi, D'Evils, dime bag, dlj11166, i-moses, knightmelodic, KW13537, papi68, PDQ21, Riggz, TurboDerek, yaBoi, yeahman727
20.00%

Larry Bird
13:
BigSmooth, chrislee, jayjay2, jucrlgood, kmdiaopm, Kwame Coltrane, Lastdayz, massdagod, mrrayda, nycbluenoon, sandman65, teeman, xcluesiv
20.00%

Kobe Bryant
8:
ak_rep, Daddy Warbuck$, DAHITMAN, Fuzzy_McNut, jericho999, SHIN-TRAIVONUS, TimRock, weebay
12.31%

Shaquille O'Neal
6:
gdubs, HUNTSVEGAZ, jericho999, massdagod, TimRock, xbootsey
9.23%

Hakeem Olajuwon
4:
DAHITMAN, dime bag, Fuzzy_McNut, papi68
6.15%

George Mikan
2:
dlj11166, yeahman727
3.08%

Tim Duncan
2:
Daddy Warbuck$, wiZe
3.08%

Karl Malone
1:
massdagod
1.54%

Joe Hammond
1
kain
1.54%

Charles Barkley
0
0%

Kevin Durant
0
0%​

 

[Art Vandelay]

#3 Bill Russell and #4 Wilt Chamberlain combined, with some people having voted for both of them and being counted twice, do not receive as man votes as Michael Jordan.

That is amazing.

 

[Maxxam]

Man Lie. Women Lie. Numbers Don't.



11 rings >>

I think this guy might know a thing or two about MJ
Phil Jackson: Bill Russell over Jordan





Bill's greedy ass is still winning

 

[bgque12]

There is no way to get around this fact! The league and the officials changed the rules to make it easier for Jordan!! That is a fact! He didn't win a championship until after they changed the rules. They also added a defensive 3 second to clear the lane out even more. Probably the biggest rule changed that helped him was getting rid of the hand check.

I am not saying he is not one of the greats but not in my Rushmore greats.

 

[Better]

There is no way to get around this fact! The league and the officials changed the rules to make it easier for Jordan!! That is a fact! He didn't win a championship until after they changed the rules. They also added a defensive 3 second to clear the lane out even more. Probably the biggest rule changed that helped him was getting rid of the hand check.

I am not saying he is not one of the greats but not in my Rushmore greats.

After massadagod is done reading this, and he recovers from his stroke, he's coming for you.

 

[bgque12]

After massdagod is done reading this, and he recovers from his stroke, he's coming for you.

 

[massdagod]

Michael Jordan's Bulls team from 20 Years ago averaged 92-93 possessions a game. (92.5 to be exact)

Possessions a game in 2014 is 94.0 possessions per game on the Dot...

the Average possession is Higher than Michael Jordan's Bulls of 20 years ago...

But You aint know that... That pretty much Kills your Own Arguement.

The year Michael Jordan averaged 37.1ppg, his team averaged 95 possession per game.... They would be 10th in the League Today.

Fact.

Kill'm With Facts.





Man Lie, women Lie, Numbers Don't. Jordan = GOAT










Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

Stop Right there.


In 86-87, Michael Jordan's Bulls averaged 95.8 possessions a Game.

Wilt Chamberlain meaningless 61-62 regular season averaged 50.4 points in 131.1 possessions in 48.5 minutes.
The GOATS meaningless 86-87 regular season averaged 37.1 points in 95.8 possessions in 40.0 minutes.

If the 86-87 GOAT game averaged 131.1 possession per game, he would have averaged 52.9 points per game...

If the 86-87 GOAT played 48.5 minutes in the same season of 131.1 possessions per game, he would have averaged 63.4 points per game...

Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell's
rebounding is also inflated.. If u look at rebounding percentages and break it down, Wilt and Russell's career 19.9% and 18.7% rebound percentage would be equivalent to around 12-13 rebounds a game in the modern NBA.

This is why Dennis Rodman is the greatest rebounder Ever. because his career average of 23.6% of available rebounds is by far better than everyone else's.

Oscar in the modern NBA wouldn't averaged anything close to a triple double.. In fact, his averages in the modern NBA if you broke them down averages to Prime Grant Hill Averages.


There's a reason why Oscar Robertson spent most of his career on Losing team and/or teams that didn't even make the playoffs. Because if you broke Oscar Robertson's numbers down, you pretty much get Grant Hill Results. Fact.


Ok, he was the only player to average a Triple double... They don't tell you that he averaged that in a league that averaged 25-30 points per game more, 35 to 40 possessions more and close to 30% more rebounding opportunities due to the fact that they shot much more and missed a lot more shots, with team literally averaging in the 30-percentile area in Field Goal percentage...

Everything I stated is Facts.

If you want to allow modern day NBA players to play in the years of inflated numbers the you would have to know this:

Michael Jordan would have averaged over 50ppg in a season twice.
Kobe Bryant would have averaged over 50PPG in a season once.

In an "inflated" statistical NBA, if his career would have been from the mid-late 50's to the early 70's, Michael Jordan would have a far better scoring average (regular and post season) PPG average than he had and he already leads in NBA history.

Michael Jordan would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Lebron James would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Jason Kidd would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 5 times.

Dennis Rodman would have averaged over 30 rebounds in a season at least 5 times.


Since we are on the Subject of stats:

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And did it with Much less talented teams than other Legends I might add; especially during his 1st 3-Peat..

And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

Kill'm With Facts.





Man Lie. Women Lie. Numbers Don't. Jordan = GOAT

 

[D'Evils]

There is no way to get around this fact! The league and the officials changed the rules to make it easier for Jordan!! That is a fact! He didn't win a championship until after they changed the rules. They also added a defensive 3 second to clear the lane out even more. Probably the biggest rule changed that helped him was getting rid of the hand check.

I am not saying he is not one of the greats but not in my Rushmore greats.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_history.html

What rule was changed from 84 to 91 that helped Jordan

1984-85
• The number of timeouts teams are allowed in overtime increased from two to three regardless of the number of timeouts called or remaining during the regulation play or previous overtimes.
• If a foul is committed against any offensive player in his frontcourt, who has a clear path to the basket and is thereby deprived of the opportunity to score, a second free throw and possession of the ball out of bounds shall be awarded.
• Fine increased from $100 to $500 for coaches and players who do not leave the court and go directly to their dressing rooms, without pause or delay, at halftime and the end of each game.
• Fine increased from $150 to $500 for a player not in the game who does not remain in the vicinity of his team’s bench during a fight.
1988-89
• Number of referees officiating game increased from two to three.
1990-91
• Penalties for flagrant fouls increased such that an infraction is penalized by two free throw attempts and possession of the ball out-of-bounds. The offender may also be ejected if there is no apparent effort to play the ball and/or, in the official’s judgment, the contact was of such an excessive nature that an injury could have occurred. Ejected players will be automatically fined $250.
• :00.3 must expire on the clock when a ball is inbounded and then hit instantly out-of-bounds
• :00.3 is needed on the clock to catch the ball and shoot it into the basket whether the shot is made or not.
• :00.3 must expire on the clock when a player gets possession of a missed free throw and immediately requests a timeout.
• :00.1 is needed on the clock to tip the ball in the basket whether the shot is made or not.

Defensive 3 Second rules

1966-67
The following language was added to the Zone Defense Rule: "After the offensive team has advanced the ball to its front court, a defensive player may not station himself in the key area longer than three seconds if it is apparent he is making no effort to play an opponent. The three second count starts when the offensive team is in clear control in the front court."

1981-82
a. Weak side defenders may come in the pro lane (16’), but not in the college lane (12’) for more than three seconds.
b. Defender on post player is allowed in defensive three-second area (A post player is any player adjacent to paint area)

2001
A new defensive three-second rule will prohibit a defensive player from remaining in the lane for more than three consecutive seconds without closely guarding an offensive player.

2004-05
New rules were introduced to curtail hand-checking, clarify blocking fouls and call defensive three seconds to open up the game

Hand Check rules

1978-79
Clarification added to prohibit hand-checking through “rigid enforcement” of rule allowing a defensive player to retain contact with his opponent so long as he does not impede his opponent’s progress.

1994-95
Hand-checking eliminated from the end line in the backcourt to the opposite foul line.

1997-98
A defender will not be permitted to use his forearm to impede the progress of an offensive player who is facing the basket in the frontcourt.

2004-05
New rules were introduced to curtail hand-checking, clarify blocking fouls and call defensive three seconds to open up the game

 

[bgque12]

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_history.html

What rule was changed from 84 to 91 that helped Jordan

Dude look. I covered the NBA I. The eay '90's when I worked at NPR I Philly. I know the sport. The changed the rules to stop
Detroit and everyone else from hard fouls I. The lane and a defensive 3'seconds was added to keep the lane clear. And if you know the sport the way you claim you know that many other rules have been on the books but do not become a point of emphasis until the league commissioner think they should. Jordan didn't win a championship until they changed the rules to stop Detroit. And I am not even gonna mention the walks and the offensive fouls they just half out stopped calling on him. Look at the YouTube vid I posted. That was an offensive foul that everyone saw. But they didn't call it because it was. Jordan.

 

[massdagod]

As an individual player, Jordan is far greater than the 4 you mentioned above.

Outside of Kareem (mid to end of career), Wilt, Russell and Oscar had inflated stats.

If you break down the numbers:

(WC 61/62) 50ppg in a season where his team averaged 126ppg averaging a pace of 131 possessions in a game.

VS

(MJ 86/87) 37ppg in a season where his team averaged 104ppg averaging a pace of 95 possessions in a game.


Jordan's season is Far more impressive. That's a Fact.

Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell's
rebounding is also inflated.. If u look at rebounding percentages and break it down, Wilt and Russell's career 19.9% and 18.7% rebound percentage would be equivalent to around 12-13 rebounds a game in the modern NBA.

This is why Dennis Rodman is the greatest rebounder Ever. because his career average of 23.6% of available rebounds is by far better than everyone else's.

Oscar in the modern NBA wouldn't averaged anything close to a triple double.. In fact, his averages in the modern NBA if you broke them down averages to Prime Grant Hill Averages.


There's a reason why Oscar Robertson spent most of his career on Losing team and/or teams that didn't even make the playoffs. Because if you broke Oscar Robertson's numbers down, you pretty much get Grant Hill Results. Fact.


Ok, he was the only player to average a Triple double... They don't tell you that he averaged that in a league that averaged 25-30 points per game more, 35 to 40 possessions more and close to 30% more rebounding opportunities due to the fact that they shot much more and missed a lot more shots, with team literally averaging in the 30-percentile area in Field Goal percentage...

Everything I stated is Facts.

If you want to allow modern day NBA players to play in the years of inflated numbers the you would have to know this:

Michael Jordan would have averaged over 50ppg in a season twice.
Kobe Bryant would have averaged over 50PPG in a season once.

In an "inflated" statistical NBA, if his career would have been from the mid-late 50's to the early 70's, Michael Jordan would have a far better scoring average (regular and post season) PPG average than he had and he already leads in NBA history.

Michael Jordan would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Lebron James would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Jason Kidd would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 5 times.

Dennis Rodman would have averaged over 30 rebounds in a season at least 5 times.


Since we are on the Subject of stats:

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

Michael Jordan's Bulls team from 20 Years ago averaged 92-93 possessions a game. (92.5 to be exact)

Possessions a game in 2014 is 94.0 possessions per game on the Dot...

the Average possession is Higher than Michael Jordan's Bulls of 20 years ago...

But You aint know that... That pretty much Kills your Own Arguement.

The year Michael Jordan averaged 37.1ppg, his team averaged 95 possession per game... They would be 10th in the League Today.

Fact.

Kill'm With Facts.





Man Lie, women Lie, Numbers Don't. Jordan = GOAT










Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

Stop Right there.


In 86-87, Michael Jordan's Bulls averaged 95.8 possessions a Game.

Wilt Chamberlain meaningless 61-62 regular season averaged 50.4 points in 131.1 possessions in 48.5 minutes.
The GOATS meaningless 86-87 regular season averaged 37.1 points in 95.8 possessions in 40.0 minutes.

If the 86-87 GOAT game averaged 131.1 possession per game, he would have averaged 52.9 points per game...

If the 86-87 GOAT played 48.5 minutes in the same season of 131.1 possessions per game, he would have averaged 63.4 points per game...

Wilt Chamberlain, Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell's
rebounding is also inflated.. If u look at rebounding percentages and break it down, Wilt and Russell's career 19.9% and 18.7% rebound percentage would be equivalent to around 12-13 rebounds a game in the modern NBA.

This is why Dennis Rodman is the greatest rebounder Ever. because his career average of 23.6% of available rebounds is by far better than everyone else's.

Oscar in the modern NBA wouldn't averaged anything close to a triple double.. In fact, his averages in the modern NBA if you broke them down averages to Prime Grant Hill Averages.


There's a reason why Oscar Robertson spent most of his career on Losing team and/or teams that didn't even make the playoffs. Because if you broke Oscar Robertson's numbers down, you pretty much get Grant Hill Results. Fact.


Ok, he was the only player to average a Triple double... They don't tell you that he averaged that in a league that averaged 25-30 points per game more, 35 to 40 possessions more and close to 30% more rebounding opportunities due to the fact that they shot much more and missed a lot more shots, with team literally averaging in the 30-percentile area in Field Goal percentage...

Everything I stated is Facts.

If you want to allow modern day NBA players to play in the years of inflated numbers the you would have to know this:

Michael Jordan would have averaged over 50ppg in a season twice.
Kobe Bryant would have averaged over 50PPG in a season once.

In an "inflated" statistical NBA, if his career would have been from the mid-late 50's to the early 70's, Michael Jordan would have a far better scoring average (regular and post season) PPG average than he had and he already leads in NBA history.

Michael Jordan would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Lebron James would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 3 times.
Jason Kidd would have averaged a triple double in a season at least 5 times.

Dennis Rodman would have averaged over 30 rebounds in a season at least 5 times.


Since we are on the Subject of stats:

Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Regular season history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in Post season history. (compared to Wilt Chamberlain who is 29th in PPG in Post season history at 22ppg)
Jordan holds the Highest career PPG average in NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career PER average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Efficiency rating average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Gamescore average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest career Winshares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.
Jordan holds the Highest MVP shares average in NBA regular season, post season and NBA Finals history.

Jordan is the only player to lead the league in Scoring and Win Defensive player of the Year a season.

Jordan is the only player to Win a championship, scoring title and steals title in the same season.

Jordan is one of 3 players in NBA History to win a NBA scoring championship and NBA Championship in 1 season. George Mikan and Lew Alcindor did it once Each. Jordan did it six times. All six times also leading the playoffs in scoring. Mikan did that once and Alcindor didn't do it at all.


Statically speaking, Jordan has the Highest and most impressive Career Statistical Average in regular season, post season and Finals NBA history.

There is a reason why he Never lost a series when his team had Home Court Advantage while all other Legends have lost w/ the same stipulations multiple times.
This is Why I believe it's Trolling when someone says anyone other than Michael Jordan is the Greatest NBA player in NBA History.

There is a reason why he Never lost an NBA Finals.


And did it with Much less talented teams than other Legends I might add; especially during his 1st 3-Peat.

And These are just the Stats. We're are not even talking about Legacy or Worldwide contribution to the Game (which is by far the biggest in American SPORTS HISTORY, let alone only just basketball) - Which also counts when talking about the Greats.

Kill'm With Facts.





Man Lie. Women Lie. Numbers Don't. Jordan = GOAT