The Music Industry Generated $43 Billion in Sales Last Year. Artists Only Received 12% of That.
- Thread starter cashwhisperer
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Yes. If they don't pay it back, they don't get shit unless the label makes money.
Our first album sold about 200K + units. Our advance was 40K, but the parent label got a mil, then another $250 K for "promotion" Video and free goods (Columbia house shit)
at $6 per unit we generated 1.2 mil +
Our Share at 12% was 144K split between the crew, producer etc.
144,000
-40,000 Advance
-250,0000 Label shit
-$$$$ for whatever they could charge us back left us owing the label about 170K
We made them $$ So what they did was give us a bigger budget $75K
We sell almost 300K
Run the Numbers, same shit happens. Our first album we get 1 video they saw we were selling so they stopped promotion so they would make money and we wouldn't. The second album we get 2 videos (Label only paid for 1) so they stopped promotion.
3rd Album, held out for more money, bump up the budget to $100K sell almost gold. 450K plus units. Managed to dump one of the 2 middle men
Repeat the above math.
4th album we held out again, dumped the last middle man got $150K
Sold gold + but remember, this shit is a loan. We had to pay back some of the losses on the old albums. didn't really make shit. If it wasn't for publishing and writers BMI/ASCAP and tours we would have been broke.
These new cats with youtube, twitter Instagram and shit have no reason to not be caking. We had none of that. You sold from word of mouth and physical sales.
If you get a big budget, drop an album and flop, what label is going to pick you up? I saw a lot of acts with big budgets utterly fail, often dragging down the A&R and execs that pushed that shit. Only established acts that had hit's get a second chance.
Only flop I can think of was The RZA and GZA who re-invented themselves in Wu-tang.
I've been saying this for years. TheThe artist, like the hoe, does all the work. Has the face that everyone recognizes and the skills, yet the pimp and everyone else associated gets paid MORE and BEFORE the hoe.
These days, I don't know why people are still using record labels. You can produce your own music. Hell, people are producing their own porn! I heard folks making bank off of pornhub.
But Cardi B got enough for a $550k Lambo, and her dude (one of them dudes) got a matching one
They doing it wrong and can't nobody tell them shit
Your example has to do with recouping money On deals you stayed in. If you left music after the first album, or even just went indie-- you don't owe the label shit for what you don't make back-and the money you didn't recoup- they GAVE you more money betting that it would happen Everytime. You spent that money when you got your advances, so it ain't lie you NEVER saw money. You just didn't have to gamble like they did.Yes. If they don't pay it back, they don't get shit unless the label makes money.
Our first album sold about 200K + units. Our advance was 40K, but the parent label got a mil, then another $250 K for "promotion" Video and free goods (Columbia house shit)
at $6 per unit we generated 1.2 mil +
Our Share at 12% was 144K split between the crew, producer etc.
144,000
-40,000 Advance
-250,0000 Label shit
-$$$$ for whatever they could charge us back left us owing the label about 170K
We made them $$ So what they did was give us a bigger budget $75K
We sell almost 300K
Run the Numbers, same shit happens. Our first album we get 1 video they saw we were selling so they stopped promotion so they would make money and we wouldn't. The second album we get 2 videos (Label only paid for 1) so they stopped promotion.
3rd Album, held out for more money, bump up the budget to $100K sell almost gold. 450K plus units. Managed to dump one of the 2 middle men
Repeat the above math.
4th album we held out again, dumped the last middle man got $150K
Sold gold + but remember, this shit is a loan. We had to pay back some of the losses on the old albums. didn't really make shit. If it wasn't for publishing and writers BMI/ASCAP and tours we would have been broke.
These new cats with youtube, twitter Instagram and shit have no reason to not be caking. We had none of that. You sold from word of mouth and physical sales.
All they did through all those deals , if they indeedade their money back, was- make their money back and decide not to spend anymore in hopes that they could make more along with your profit.
But my main point is, no other business runs anything like that. When someone gives you money they want it back.
And while I do agree that the newer model puts things closer in the hands of the artist themselves and gives them instant distribution and access's to networks- they're also in a larger pool of artists vying for attention of consumers. Fickle consumers in a market no one could possibly predict what they're gonna like lol. So it's a trade-off.
Industry rule 4080..........
The artist does the work? The artist makes the music
MAYBE they do it by themselves, but mostly, they get producers. MAYBE it's a producer they know, mostly it's paid for by the label, and in many cases of old - even connected by the label. Then once it's done, it's the labels network, for promo, radio, all that shit. And whole staff dedicated to doing artwork and shit for the artist.
Nowadays , sure more artists have the ability get that buzz going but they still like to link with labels to relieve themselves of some of the work they were doing, tie into the labels networks still, and get to a bigger budget. But yeah, you pay for money you don't have starting out and work you don't wanna do. Singing songs is the easiest part.
Who cares what the truth "sounds like"? The truth is you would change places with any of those artists "getting fucked" and theyre all richer than any of us. 95% of the world would, including some of the people they claim to
Be getting fucked by.
Says the guys who were able to tour worldwide off a record they made in the 90s based off the promo they got from that label. RIP to Phife for sure. Q Tip don't have to work another day in his life if he doesn't want to. Same with Ali. Jarobi has a career as a chef and a hype man/part time rapper on huge stages, even though he didn't write one verse until last year Not a bad deal if ya ask me.Industry rule 4080..........
Also wanted to add, sounds like you had some.nice success. Hats off to you. Most people don't ever find their passion, much less realize some parts of their dreams. Salute.Yes. If they don't pay it back, they don't get shit unless the label makes money.
Our first album sold about 200K + units. Our advance was 40K, but the parent label got a mil, then another $250 K for "promotion" Video and free goods (Columbia house shit)
at $6 per unit we generated 1.2 mil +
Our Share at 12% was 144K split between the crew, producer etc.
144,000
-40,000 Advance
-250,0000 Label shit
-$$$$ for whatever they could charge us back left us owing the label about 170K
We made them $$ So what they did was give us a bigger budget $75K
We sell almost 300K
Run the Numbers, same shit happens. Our first album we get 1 video they saw we were selling so they stopped promotion so they would make money and we wouldn't. The second album we get 2 videos (Label only paid for 1) so they stopped promotion.
3rd Album, held out for more money, bump up the budget to $100K sell almost gold. 450K plus units. Managed to dump one of the 2 middle men
Repeat the above math.
4th album we held out again, dumped the last middle man got $150K
Sold gold + but remember, this shit is a loan. We had to pay back some of the losses on the old albums. didn't really make shit. If it wasn't for publishing and writers BMI/ASCAP and tours we would have been broke.
These new cats with youtube, twitter Instagram and shit have no reason to not be caking. We had none of that. You sold from word of mouth and physical sales.
If you're the type of person that knows business, has money and can manage a group of people well, then you can run your own ship and make bank in the industry. Otherwise, you gotta stick with the 12%.
I guess you never paid any attention to when artists have been sued for breech of contract...
If a label advanced an artist cash + production budget + etc and the artist walks away without delivering an album -guess what happens next?
A lawsuit for breech is the nicest possibility
without help its a very dangerous and expensive place to learn as you go
True. That's why it takes an exceptional person to make it without help.
when that song was written it was after the 1st album dropped - they made no money off it outside of merch and touring and their management and relationships had more to do with their marketing than Jive did
no one makes it without help
It takes an exceptional person to make it and still own their soul / maintain personal integrity
I spent 20 years in the business. With all the ups and downs I averaged about 50k a year.
Now I had a couple of 200k years and a 13k year.
If I wanted to dick ride I could have reached out to someone for a gig engineering, but I needed more stability for my family. Too many shady bastards that never follow through, or fighting with the label for 4 months to get a 5k check.
What I mean is,
A business savvy artist can his own people, instead of using a label and it's resources.
Publicist,
Radio Promo
Distro Rep,
Manager,
Internet Marketer.
Tour Manager,
etc.
and thats the case in every business...
you should have said "workers seek out ways"
Not necessarily true.. For a lot or most yes..for all no
It is true! look at the graph that a previous poster posted; almost all businesses/industries dont pay their employees shit; artist are employees, regardless of what they create....Even in sports, these athletes generate billions annually for these owners, and what do they get paid
labels lose bags of money each year giving stupid advances that don't recoup.
their job is to exploit the artists music and likeness by all means necessary, in order to turn a profit,
and then think about paying anyone else, ....maybe......birdman.
Like I said most not all... Pimp/,hoe relationship pimp takes all to majority of money... Manager/talent relationship majority of the money goes to the talent and manager gets a percentage... There are business that get piece of the workers revenue while the worker keeps most of the percentage... The business survives due to having lots of workers.. Barbershops/beauty salons they charge a weekly fee for the chair and the barber keeps the rest of their money... Some conventions/events charge for booths and allow the vendor to keep the rest of their money...webcam , club tip ins, etc..quiet a few business work on that modelIt is true! look at the graph that a previous poster posted; almost all businesses/industries dont pay their employees shit; artist are employees, regardless of what they create....Even in sports, these athletes generate billions annually for these owners, and what do they get paid
that artist will need to find people with expertise in key roles and some experience in the roles you listed... or at the very least the right relationships
there are wolves pitfalls scammers and a ton of well intentioned people faking it to make it...
an artist / investor etc needs money and more importantly the right relationships to navigate
An indy artist can make a lot of money and do very well - BUT -if an artist wants to be famous -the only way is via labels
The key issue is you handing over your ip to a company vs. retaining your ip and keeping majority of the profit.
If I'm a coder at Google and I come up with a groundbreaking algorithm that leads to making the company billions, I have a choice of staying with Google and making millions (probably) OR creating my own company and potentially making billions. Both options have pros & cons. The future is always unclear and hindsight is 20/20.
There's really no right or wrong choice, you just have to decide if you're willing to pay the cost to be the boss.
If I'm a coder at Google and I come up with a groundbreaking algorithm that leads to making the company billions, I have a choice of staying with Google and making millions (probably) OR creating my own company and potentially making billions. Both options have pros & cons. The future is always unclear and hindsight is 20/20.
There's really no right or wrong choice, you just have to decide if you're willing to pay the cost to be the boss.
it may be, i dunno,
in the long run the label wins anyway, as they still have the product, they can furnish it to
these streaming services and make pennies of it, year on year, with no advertising/promo outlay.
If they also have the artists publishing they win again, slowly but surely, with no further outlay or
annoying artist to keep. Cats like me are always searching out and playing "rare grooves" {good records that were not hits} on spotify and tidal, them streams add up.
The only way is through labels? ....in 1989, yeah, but not 2018, c'mon @ViCiouS niggas go viral everyday. It's just most are too uninformed on how to monetize virality. It just comes down to how smart the artist is now, including the intel they have on the industry. Yeah there are scammers, but if you go with reputable people you can win. Remember, I said "business savvy" artist. If an artist knows how to handle money well (ie, not pissing off all the money and instead pouring it back into the business), they can win.
I'm not saying it's a formula for most, I'm talking about the exceptional ones.
Lol thAt term famous is very subjective ... Thanks to social media fame is easily more attainable... Also certain popular outlets like the breakfast club and other stations will invite certain indie acts due to their popularity or possible ability to even get bigger..also certain venues like governors ball will invite certain indie acts due to their cult followings.. It's all about promotion, product, consumer base as far as money generated and popularity