Diddy Says Drake Is Top 5 All Time

[TimRock]

Alot of people do consider him the goat already, the number and influences don't lie.

All Im hearing is, well if it's Drake then number don't count.. And if they do count then it's more about impact. And if he does have that much influence then, he has to be a lyricist, and if he has good lyrical content, he has to have written it all, and if the other rapers on said list have had writers, then his content is too soft, and if his unique content is consumed by the majority of people, then it's just not hip hop and doesn't count

But if you're not even a top 20 or 30 lyricists, which consists of actually rapping and talking about something, how could you be considered goat? Damn the numbers, all it proves is that you can sell, which is great.

Who would you consider to be the top 10 lyricists of all time. And tell me why Drake is not a great lyricist.

 

[wwetv100]

Alot of people do consider him the goat already, the number and influences don't lie.

All Im hearing is, well if it's Drake then number don't count.. And if they do count then it's more about impact. And if he does have that much influence then, he has to be a lyricist, and if he has good lyrical content, he has to have written it all, and if the other rapers on said list have had writers, then his content is too soft, and if his unique content is consumed by the majority of people, then it's just not hip hop and doesn't count

See this is what I mean. The majority of the time when it comes to GOAT lists for music or sports or tv shows etc., there are usually a consensus of artists that even if someone disagrees they can see why they are chosen. The same variables is what most agree on. I'm talking in general and not when it comes down to hardcore fans.

Just from a quick google search to show the generality of how this topic will always break down to more than numbers..............


As of 2017, based on both sales claims and certified units, The Beatles are considered the highest-selling band. Elvis Presley is considered the highest-selling individual artist based on sales claims and Drake is the highest-selling individual artist based on certified units.

List of best-selling music artists - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

How many different people would claim that someone like Michael Jackson, but then there would be people who would pull out this stat above to show that Elvis is the King over King of Pop. According to this, Elvis and Drake are the two greatest ever. We know 99% to 100% guesstimate that no one on this board would call Elvis the goat of anything.

The things with these GOAT lists is keeping the same energy imo and it always does come down to preference and connection. Someone who grew up in the era of Drake would not understand the scope more times on why someone may say a 90's rapper is greater because they just did not live through it.

However, this should not be used against some of the newer guys like Drake breaking records, but if purchasing and buying tastes are broader and changed from how things were before then how can we legitimately have a GOAT list. It is all subjective imo.

 

[Day_Carver]

See this is what I mean. The majority of the time when it comes to GOAT lists for music or sports or tv shows etc., there are usually a consensus of artists that even if someone disagrees they can see why they are chosen. The same variables is what most agree on. I'm talking in general and not when it comes down to hardcore fans.

Just from a quick google search to show the generality of how this topic will always break down to more than numbers..............


As of 2017, based on both sales claims and certified units, The Beatles are considered the highest-selling band. Elvis Presley is considered the highest-selling individual artist based on sales claims and Drake is the highest-selling individual artist based on certified units.

List of best-selling music artists - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

How many different people would claim that someone like Michael Jackson, but then there would be people who would pull out this stat above to show that Elvis is the King over King of Pop. According to this, Elvis and Drake are the two greatest ever. We know 99% to 100% guesstimate that no one on this board would call Elvis the goat of anything.

The things with these GOAT lists is keeping the same energy imo and it always does come down to preference and connection. Someone who grew up in the era of Drake would not understand the scope more times on why someone may say a 90's rapper is greater because they just did not live through it.

However, this should not be used against some of the newer guys like Drake breaking records, but if purchasing and buying tastes are broader and changed from how things were before then how can we legitimately have a GOAT list. It is all subjective imo.

They aren't even using the same metrics for records now. STREAMING IS NOT SELLING!!!!!!!!!!@ its really just stupid how peoples are even comparing this shit to artists who actually sold fucking records/albums. The only one selling in hip hop is Kendrick lol. Drake sales a little bit but its mostly streams..... .

 

[wwetv100]

They aren't even using the same metrics for records now. STREAMING IS NOT SELLING!!!!!!!!!!@ its really just stupid how peoples are even comparing this shit to artists who actually sold fucking records/albums. The only one selling in hip hop is Kendrick lol. Drake sales a little bit but its mostly streams..... .

This is why the change can't just be brushed away. They started counting streams because the actual sales were way more down. I see the argument on both sides on why the change in counting is needed, but also see why it also points to a bigger problem of people just not keeping the same habits of the past.

We all know with the music industry there have always been things down to inflate numbers until the system is changed to correct manipulation. Last year Youtube changed up how they counted their charting for artists because of how record companies were rigging numbers.


Article:
YouTube’s music chart system has faced a few controversies over the last few months. In July, Indian rapper Badshah broke the record for most views in 24 hours, beating out BTS with 75 million views to their 74.6 million just months earlier. But people suspected that the rapper’s view total was inflated with artificial views. Bloomberg later reported that Badshah and his team purchased advertisements that either embedded or promoted the video. This led to a dramatically increased view count. YouTube decided not to acknowledge the record-breaking numbers.

“Video advertising is an effective way to reach specific audiences with a song debut, but paid advertising views on YouTube will no longer be considered when looking at a 24-hour record debut,” the blog post reads.

Similar tactics are often used by movie studios and TV networks that fight for record-breaking numbers, but those won’t be impacted. A YouTube spokesperson told The Verge that the change “is focused on aligning YouTube Music Charts and records with the industry standard and how we report to Nielsen and other third party charting companies.” The company isn’t making any platform-wide changes.

YouTube is changing how it counts views for record-breaking music videos after controversy

Everything must come from organic views.

www.theverge.com

This is just one aspect of how streaming had to be adjusted for numbers. Now, if numbers are all equal how do we adjust artists already on the record books who don't get their records adjusted for today? It doesn't happen. This is why I think there will always be people who will dispute generational comparisons for GOAT lists.

 

[Day_Carver]

This is why the change can't just be brushed away. They started counting streams because the actual sales were way more down. I see the argument on both sides on why the change in counting is needed, but also see why it also points to a bigger problem of people just not keeping the same habits of the past.

We all know with the music industry there have always been things down to inflate numbers until the system is changed to correct manipulation. Last year Youtube changed up how they counted their charting for artists because of how record companies were rigging numbers.


Article:
YouTube’s music chart system has faced a few controversies over the last few months. In July, Indian rapper Badshah broke the record for most views in 24 hours, beating out BTS with 75 million views to their 74.6 million just months earlier. But people suspected that the rapper’s view total was inflated with artificial views. Bloomberg later reported that Badshah and his team purchased advertisements that either embedded or promoted the video. This led to a dramatically increased view count. YouTube decided not to acknowledge the record-breaking numbers.

“Video advertising is an effective way to reach specific audiences with a song debut, but paid advertising views on YouTube will no longer be considered when looking at a 24-hour record debut,” the blog post reads.

Similar tactics are often used by movie studios and TV networks that fight for record-breaking numbers, but those won’t be impacted. A YouTube spokesperson told The Verge that the change “is focused on aligning YouTube Music Charts and records with the industry standard and how we report to Nielsen and other third party charting companies.” The company isn’t making any platform-wide changes.

YouTube is changing how it counts views for record-breaking music videos after controversy

Everything must come from organic views.

www.theverge.com

This is just one aspect of how streaming had to be adjusted for numbers. Now, if numbers are all equal how do we adjust artists already on the record books who don't get their records adjusted for today? It doesn't happen. This is why I think there will always be people who will dispute generational comparisons for GOAT lists.

I have no problem counting numbers. I think streaming should be counted and artists should be paid appropriately. However I just don’t think they should be counted as sales when no one is buying anything. All streaming is is a more advanced form of radio play..that’s it. So it should be viewed as that. If they did that then all these so called feats that the new artist are claiming wouldn’t be happening. I don’t know how lil uzi can “sell” 286,000 plus albums1st week but only actually sold 1000 actual albums. But because of streaming that shit is mad retarted. Plus he doesn’t even get paid like he sold that many albums so why count them as sales??? Shit is fugazi. And comparing drake to the greats well that’s funny as well. I’m still waiting for someone to tell me which drakes album stands up against the greats albums. I mean he doesn’t even have an album that compares to good kid madd city. Hell he doesn’t even have an album that compares to get rich or die trying; but ima shut my mouth...........

 

[LennyNero1972]

Drake sux.

 

[God Dammit]

I’ll leave the dick sucking to you, since that was your first response that sounds like it’s in your mind and a passion. Maybe even your national pastime or your go to move when happy or angry.

And I never said he was too 5.

​

Suck a dick faggot.
Nah lil nigga.
I just say it because it’s nothing more disrespectful than telling a loser to suck a dick.​

 

[Heavenlywings77]

See this is what I mean. The majority of the time when it comes to GOAT lists for music or sports or tv shows etc., there are usually a consensus of artists that even if someone disagrees they can see why they are chosen. The same variables is what most agree on. I'm talking in general and not when it comes down to hardcore fans.

Just from a quick google search to show the generality of how this topic will always break down to more than numbers..............


As of 2017, based on both sales claims and certified units, The Beatles are considered the highest-selling band. Elvis Presley is considered the highest-selling individual artist based on sales claims and Drake is the highest-selling individual artist based on certified units.

List of best-selling music artists - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

How many different people would claim that someone like Michael Jackson, but then there would be people who would pull out this stat above to show that Elvis is the King over King of Pop. According to this, Elvis and Drake are the two greatest ever. We know 99% to 100% guesstimate that no one on this board would call Elvis the goat of anything.

The things with these GOAT lists is keeping the same energy imo and it always does come down to preference and connection. Someone who grew up in the era of Drake would not understand the scope more times on why someone may say a 90's rapper is greater because they just did not live through it.

However, this should not be used against some of the newer guys like Drake breaking records, but if purchasing and buying tastes are broader and changed from how things were before then how can we legitimately have a GOAT list. It is all subjective imo.

It's not all subjective. There are facts behind things. Give me criteria that you yourself won't break. (Not you personally)..
Don't tell me you think it's Macklemore cause he has an M in his name and to be a goat your name must begin with M then when I say 'well what about MC Hammer, he has an M in his name and his stats are better' only to then break your own criteria and add in well yeah but Hammer had a high top, that's lame so he doesn't count. Have some consistency in your own lists.

 

[Heavenlywings77]

But if you're not even a top 20 or 30 lyricists, which consists of actually rapping and talking about something, how could you be considered goat? Damn the numbers, all it proves is that you can sell, which is great.

Who would you consider to be the top 10 lyricists of all time. And tell me why Drake is not a great lyricist.

But then that's your list. That's fine as long as you stick by your own criteria. The only thing I would say to counter your poin tis, there are soooooooooooooooo many influential rappers throughout history that aren't lyricists it's not even funny

Biz Markie
Kanye
Drake
Hammer

Future
Lil' Kim
Puffy
Easy E
DMX
ODB
2/3rds of the Fugees
I can go on and on and on

I wouldnt imagine what rap wpuld be without these guys contributions!!!!!!!! You'll never tell me that you honestly believe that Canibus was a more pivotal rapper than Lil Kim.

 

[Heavenlywings77]

Drake is great with hits and this era of fake sales. Drake is popular like McDonald's. They might sell the most burgers doesn't mean their burgers are the best nor in top 10 of burgers joints. Hes not even the best of his era. So there's no way he can be in top 5......

You know how many artists you can say that about? And McDonald's might not be YOUR favorite burgers, but they are McDonald's for a reason. Everyone fucking loves them. This would exactly be arguing that McDonald's isn't a top 5 restaurant when we all know it's number 1.

Ican't imagine how Drake is not the best of this or any other generation. He doesn't have to be your favorite, just like McDonald's doesn't have to be your favorite spot. But just because you dislike it doesn't mean everyone else feels that way. Your outnumbered vastly in your opinion.

My favorite rappers are the Lox.. Do I have the standing to say they're better than Drake??? No, that would be insane

 

[Day_Carver]

You know how many artists you can say that about? And McDonald's might not be YOUR favorite burgers, but they are McDonald's for a reason. Everyone fucking loves them. This would exactly be arguing that McDonald's isn't a top 5 restaurant when we all know it's number 1.

Ican't imagine how Drake is not the best of this or any other generation. He doesn't have to be your favorite, just like McDonald's doesn't have to be your favorite spot. But just because you dislike it doesn't mean everyone else feels that way. Your outnumbered vastly in your opinion.

My favorite rappers are the Lox.. Do I have the standing to say they're better than Drake??? No, that would be insane

What makes Drake the best; the only thing that you can say is sales thats it; not content, not lyrical ability, not skills, etc... just sales; again tell me which one of Drakes albums is better than Good Kidd Madd City, name 1

 

[Heavenlywings77]

What makes Drake the best; the only thing that you can say is sales thats it; not content, not lyrical ability, not skills, etc... just sales; again tell me which one of Drakes albums is better than Good Kidd Madd City, name 1

But I can say he's the best for all that stuff you said I couldn't name. And is this criteria based off your own personal feelings??? What are we basing this off of?

 

[REDLINE]

Suck a dick faggot.
Nah lil nigga.
I just say it because it’s nothing more disrespectful than telling a loser to suck a dick.​

Actually there is one more thing that’s more disrespectful.

A man doesn’t respect you enough to face him so yo ho ass can’t even suck his dick, you have to eat his ass.

So go eat a man’s as you worthless piece of shit.

And maybe one day you’ll do a good enough job so that you can finally face the front and suck his dick.

I’m sure that’ll make you happy, dick’s in your mouth always make you happy.

Now go play with yourself, or go do something more faggit friendly.

 

[God Dammit]

Actually there is one more thing that’s more disrespectful.

A man doesn’t respect you enough to face him so yo ho ass can’t even suck his dick, you have to eat his ass.

So go eat a man’s as you worthless piece of shit.

And maybe one day you’ll do a good enough job so that you can finally face the front and suck his dick.

I’m sure that’ll make you happy, dick’s in your mouth always make you happy.

Now go play with yourself, or go do something more faggit friendly.

​

You typed all that so you must be mad as hell, lmao!​

 

[REDLINE]

You typed all that so you must be mad as hell, lmao!​

Believe it not, not at all and I couldn’t even tell you what I typed.

I just trade insult for insult, it’s automatic.

 

[Day_Carver]

But I can say he's the best for all that stuff you said I couldn't name. And is this criteria based off your own personal feelings??? What are we basing this off of?

No u can't though. His lyrical ability and content is subpar. He has a great team behind him though and he produces hits. Hey I give him credit he makes hit songs. But again outside of sales to me drake's doesn't compare. Again which one of his albums can rival good kidd mad city. Nigga dont even write his own music. Hell which one can rival dam? I mean kdot is far and away the better rapper. Its not close. But hold on to drake's hits though.........

 

[REDLINE]

No u can't though. His lyrical ability and content is subpar. He has a great team behind him though and he produces hits. Hey I give him credit he makes hit songs. But again outside of sales to me drake's doesn't compare. Again which one of his albums can rival good kidd mad city. Nigga dont even write his own music. Hell which one can rival dam? I mean kdot is far and away the better rapper. Its not close. But hold on to drake's hits though.........

The things about some of Drake’s “Hits” are, are they really “Hits”?

People buy whatever he makes because he’s popular. On paper “Tootsie Slide” is number and technically a “Hit”. But come on, it’s not a hit song and that’s why many Hip Hop fans don’t really respect his accolades when it comes to “Hits”

His fans will say “He’s got another hit” but everyone else is saying

 

[bigsexxxy38]

Biggie Smalls is TOP 2 ALL TIME!

 

[wwetv100]

It's not all subjective. There are facts behind things. Give me criteria that you yourself won't break. (Not you personally)..
Don't tell me you think it's Macklemore cause he has an M in his name and to be a goat your name must begin with M then when I say 'well what about MC Hammer, he has an M in his name and his stats are better' only to then break your own criteria and add in well yeah but Hammer had a high top, that's lame so he doesn't count. Have some consistency in your own lists.

I totally get what you mean by moving goal posts. The problems with just being objective instead of subjective with music goes back to my issue with numbers could be manipulated and numbers can mean something in different eras. Personally, I believe Drake's numbers can't just be ignored because he obviously is doing something historic.

My issues sometimes comes when I see people throwing around GOAT at artists in the modern day and not taking history into account and time periods. Using stats there sometimes comes the apples vs oranges comparison. For example using Diddy's label and numbers would it really be fair to compare it with Berry Gordy's Motown label under the circumstances they faced in their time? Should we just use straight up facts or also throw in variables that aren't seen on hard numbers?

I have no problem counting numbers. I think streaming should be counted and artists should be paid appropriately. However I just don’t think they should be counted as sales when no one is buying anything. All streaming is is a more advanced form of radio play..that’s it. So it should be viewed as that. If they did that then all these so called feats that the new artist are claiming wouldn’t be happening. I don’t know how lil uzi can “sell” 286,000 plus albums1st week but only actually sold 1000 actual albums. But because of streaming that shit is mad retarted. Plus he doesn’t even get paid like he sold that many albums so why count them as sales??? Shit is fugazi. And comparing drake to the greats well that’s funny as well. I’m still waiting for someone to tell me which drakes album stands up against the greats albums. I mean he doesn’t even have an album that compares to good kid madd city. Hell he doesn’t even have an album that compares to get rich or die trying; but ima shut my mouth...........

Yeah I agree that it does cause an inflated number and there are people out there that don't even know that streams count towards sales. So if Nicki's popularity and impact wasn't what it was would the streaming aspect in terms of adding to stats been counted? Look at the controversy some guys we know who sold in the past had people questioning the new model they helped to usher in such as Jay Z with bundling downloads with corporations such as Sprint? I don't know.

Here's Why Jay-Z's 4:44 Album Went Platinum So Quickly

Turns out the only fan he needed to impress was Sprint.

www.buzzfeednews.com

 

[Heavenlywings77]

I totally get what you mean by moving goal posts. The problems with just being objective instead of subjective with music goes back to my issue with numbers could be manipulated and numbers can mean something in different eras. Personally, I believe Drake's numbers can't just be ignored because he obviously is doing something historic.

My issues sometimes comes when I see people throwing around GOAT at artists in the modern day and not taking history into account and time periods. Using stats there sometimes comes the apples vs oranges comparison. For example using Diddy's label and numbers would it really be fair to compare it with Berry Gordy's Motown label under the circumstances they faced in their time? Should we just use straight up facts or also throw in variables that aren't seen on hard numbers?

Here's Why Jay-Z's 4:44 Album Went Platinum So Quickly

Turns out the only fan he needed to impress was Sprint.

www.buzzfeednews.com

Post makes a lot of sense man..Anything can be compared and contrasted. What's with this new mindset that apples and orangescan't be compared??? I never got it

They both fruit, both have citrus, both have seeds. That wasn't hard atall. I can compare and contrast Drake to any time period. But this is about if he is a GOAT, and based off this era, he did lots of things that would cement him as that. I could take Jay Z and put him in the 60's where he had no influence, I could compare him to Michael Jackson, does that then take away his GOAT status. And when I say GOAT , I mean 1 of the GOATS. The honestly thee GOAT is Michael Jackson

 

[Heavenlywings77]

No u can't though. His lyrical ability and content is subpar. He has a great team behind him though and he produces hits. Hey I give him credit he makes hit songs. But again outside of sales to me drake's doesn't compare. Again which one of his albums can rival good kidd mad city. Nigga dont even write his own music. Hell which one can rival dam? I mean kdot is far and away the better rapper. Its not close. But hold on to drake's hits though.........

That's your own opinion, outside of you, more people tend to think his content and wordplay are great. And if you checked the numbers his albums consistently beat Kendrick's so I don't get why your bringing up criteria that would prove your points wrong

 

[Gods_Debris]

Nigga put Pac number one lol. How Sway?

I love Pac, but c’mon man. Wait a minute. 50 Cent #3.

aiight, I’m out

I read 50 at #3 and knew this joker was bull jivin!

 

[Heavenlywings77]

What makes Drake the best; the only thing that you can say is sales thats it; not content, not lyrical ability, not skills, etc... just sales; again tell me which one of Drakes albums is better than Good Kidd Madd City, name 1

Check out the numbers, You can find that out for yourself. Unless you mean in my opinion.

 

[Gods_Debris]

Post makes a lot of sense man..Anything can be compared and contrasted. What's with this new mindset that apples and orangescan't be compared??? I never got it

They both fruit, both have citrus, both have seeds. That wasn't hard atall. I can compare and contrast Drake to any time period. But this is about if he is a GOAT, and based off this era, he did lots of things that would cement him as that. I could take Jay Z and put him in the 60's where he had no influence, I could compare him to Michael Jackson, does that then take away his GOAT status. And when I say GOAT , I mean 1 of the GOATS. The honestly thee GOAT is Michael Jackson

Where you gettin them citrus apples from nigga?

 

[Heavenlywings77]

Where you gettin them citrus apples from nigga?

Lmaooo, you right! That's a contrast thing lol.. lol

 

[wwetv100]

Post makes a lot of sense man..Anything can be compared and contrasted. What's with this new mindset that apples and orangescan't be compared??? I never got it

They both fruit, both have citrus, both have seeds. That wasn't hard atall. I can compare and contrast Drake to any time period. But this is about if he is a GOAT, and based off this era, he did lots of things that would cement him as that. I could take Jay Z and put him in the 60's where he had no influence, I could compare him to Michael Jackson, does that then take away his GOAT status. And when I say GOAT , I mean 1 of the GOATS. The honestly thee GOAT is Michael Jackson

You proved my point that yes there are comparisons to apples and oranges in terms of both having seeds, but they are also different. Yes, you can compare Jay Z to Michael Jackson. They are the same in terms of being artists that create music, but they are also different in that they came up in different times and accomplished different things on creating different music for different people.

However, will all Jay Z fans understand or appreciate Michael Jackson the same way that someone from 60's to 90's would appreciate Michael Jackson? Will Michael Jackson fans from that time frame appreciate what Jay Z did for hip hop the same way? No because they are from different time and the audience hits differently, but if one can hit more than their generation at a greater scope that catapults the guy into more of the GOAT status because of generational reach.

For instance, Michael Jackson broke down doors for music videos with songs like Billie Jean and awed the world with the moonwalk on television for Motown 25. How are you suppose to categorize that with a rapper who literally and figuratively can't compare with that? Are you going to say numbers alone takes away from the greatness of such feats?

Then someone may say that Jay Z is the first billionaire rapper and then someone could say that Michael was still more powerful holding the catalog of all the top artists from his wife to the Beatles. Forbes say he was worth 4.2 billion in 2018 in his life and death. Which is feat is greater?

In actuality, comparing Michael Jackson and Jay Z is apples and oranges. Neither of the two could have done what the other did. Going off strictly numbers MJ has him beat, but that doesn't tell of the story of what Jay Z did.

Now to the Drake and GOAT talk. Could Drake have done what Jay Z did? He could as he still has time left, but he still wouldn't be rap's first billionaire even if he surpassed his number. The first accolade will always seem more insurmountable because of the odds of it not happening were much greater. Now everyone knows it is possible.

This is why I brought up the 60's and 90's. Sure, Jay Z and Dame Dash could break records as an independent label, but everyone knew it was possible for a black label to do big things because Def Jam already made records making records for hip hop. Just as it seemed possible for Def Jam to make records because of black labels before it smashing records such as Motown.

The playing field for 90's labels is different than a label such as Motown because they had to play by different rules. The rules of today are different from the rules of artists before. It is like the argument in basketball on whether or not Jordan would be scoring 40-50 points a game (Stephen A Smith) with today's playing field. Thus, it still makes it apples and oranges. Although it is the same thing, there are still differences.

What makes Drake special is he is doing numbers with domination, but one could argue rules were augmented which helped to dominate. While artists before him didn't have augmentation to the degree he had to assist in his dominating(the stream numbers and sales are different, but the weekly and year to year domination is comparable).

 

[footloose]

Math Hoffa picks drake over lil Wayne. Says drakes a whole different type of beast.
3:02:00 mark

 

[Heavenlywings77]

You proved my point that yes there are comparisons to apples and oranges in terms of both having seeds, but they are also different. Yes, you can compare Jay Z to Michael Jackson. They are the same in terms of being artists that create music, but they are also different in that they came up in different times and accomplished different things on creating different music for different people.

However, will all Jay Z fans understand or appreciate Michael Jackson the same way that someone from 60's to 90's would appreciate Michael Jackson? Will Michael Jackson fans from that time frame appreciate what Jay Z did for hip hop the same way? No because they are from different time and the audience hits differently, but if one can hit more than their generation at a greater scope that catapults the guy into more of the GOAT status because of generational reach.

For instance, Michael Jackson broke down doors for music videos with songs like Billie Jean and awed the world with the moonwalk on television for Motown 25. How are you suppose to categorize that with a rapper who literally and figuratively can't compare with that? Are you going to say numbers alone takes away from the greatness of such feats?

Then someone may say that Jay Z is the first billionaire rapper and then someone could say that Michael was still more powerful holding the catalog of all the top artists from his wife to the Beatles. Forbes say he was worth 4.2 billion in 2018 in his life and death. Which is feat is greater?

In actuality, comparing Michael Jackson and Jay Z is apples and oranges. Neither of the two could have done what the other did. Going off strictly numbers MJ has him beat, but that doesn't tell of the story of what Jay Z did.

Now to the Drake and GOAT talk. Could Drake have done what Jay Z did? He could as he still has time left, but he still wouldn't be rap's first billionaire even if he surpassed his number. The first accolade will always seem more insurmountable because of the odds of it not happening were much greater. Now everyone knows it is possible.

This is why I brought up the 60's and 90's. Sure, Jay Z and Dame Dash could break records as an independent label, but everyone knew it was possible for a black label to do big things because Def Jam already made records making records for hip hop. Just as it seemed possible for Def Jam to make records because of black labels before it smashing records such as Motown.

The playing field for 90's labels is different than a label such as Motown because they had to play by different rules. The rules of today are different from the rules of artists before. It is like the argument in basketball on whether or not Jordan would be scoring 40-50 points a game (Stephen A Smith) with today's playing field. Thus, it still makes it apples and oranges. Although it is the same thing, there are still differences.

What makes Drake special is he is doing numbers with domination, but one could argue rules were augmented which helped to dominate. While artists before him didn't have augmentation to the degree he had to assist in his dominating(the stream numbers and sales are different, but the weekly and year to year domination is comparable).

Looks like your doing a fine job of comparing and contrasting different artists.

 

[wwetv100]

Look what Diddy got started online lol. Maybe someone saw this thread lol.

 

[TimRock]

Look what Diddy got started online lol. Maybe someone saw this thread lol.

notice they use the term "hits" and not "skills". Souljah Boy had a hit song.

how about they play the best lyrics from both and see how that goes.

 

[wwetv100]

notice they use the term "hits" and not "skills". Souljah Boy had a hit song.

how about they play the best lyrics from both and see how that goes.

This is what I meant about generation gaps. If this were the 90's or 80's hip hop fans would not be talking about hits vs hits. It would be about battling lyric for lyric.

No one would be pitting MC Hammer versus Biggie Smalls or Diddy vs DMX and no I'm not saying Drake is MC Hammer or Diddy because he's not. He is obviously a better rapper, but no one was getting hits on charts like he is now. It would have been seen as a negative as unfair as that is.

It wasn't until guys like Biggie and Pac were getting mainstream numbers and mixing the underground did people really accept multi-platinum artists as real hip hop heads. Guys like DMX and so on followed suit.

 

[tryme2k]

Drake ain't even the best artist in Toronto right now. Tory Lanez has had the title for a minute now! The New Toronto 3 is hands down the best album so far this year!!!!