Sansa was being a bitch, what reason did she have for not trusting Daenerys?
Game Of Thrones: The Sopranos with swords or Dynasty in chainmail?
- Thread starter GAMETHEORY
- Start date
Nope.
Because some people seem to think that the way the Iron Fleet was ‘skeet shooting’ at the unsuspecting Dragons like a pair of clay pigeons... is EXACTLY the same as the Iron Fleet getting ambushed like an experienced fight jet pilot that flew in below radar.
They seem to think that the way she flew around in both episodes was exactly the same & it should have had the same outcome.
You know... like when you are just casually talking & walking with your lady down the block.... but then you get jumped & robbed.
Yeah that outcome should be exactly the same as if you was ‘on the hunt’ the next day for the nuccas who just robbed you.... spotted one of them... circled the block & decided to pull out the burner & go run down on all them nuccas. Who don’t see you coming.
The situation is completely THE SAME to certain folks. And they don’t understand why Ricky gets shot....
... but Ice Cube can eliminate his enemies....
They don’t get it.
So they blame the writers.
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@ViCiouS
Denofgeek... noticed the same thing.
I'm just going to quote a section of their review.. other then the fact that I disagree with calling it an ambush since they knew the iron fleet was there last week... They also see my main complaint... With showing the same battle scene back to back..
"The actual tactics of the early portion of the spectacle (before it becomes a massacre) is also more rewarding and satisfying than either of the last two week’s episodes, but therein lies one of several problems with season 8. In just the episode before this, a handful of scorpions were enough to kill Rhagael in an ambush that strained all credulity and common sense. Now this week, the same Daenerys who could not figure out how to strafe around the medieval sailboats with scorpions on only one side of their bows is now comfortable enough with her dragon riding to evade their spears with ease and slaughter both the Iron Fleet and all of the manned walls around King’s Landing in quick succession.
In a nutshell, this beautiful sequence makes me dislike last week’s episode even more than my initially mixed reaction, because this week actually makes plausible sense. The difference, which fans will either be able to reconcile for themselves—or not—is the difference between Benioff and Weiss’ hackneyed plotting and George R.R. Martin’s endgame.
Cersei Lannister is vain and foolish enough to think she has a chance against a dragon. Ignoring how awful the writing was to kill Rhaegal so as to make it seem like Cersei has a fighting chance, this is the delusions of a fool who believed she was every bit as cunning as her father when she became the first secular monarch in centuries to cede power to the church by arming an especially fanatical wing of septons. She managed to pull a miraculous win out of the clutches of defeat by blowing up the Great Sept of Baelor, but that act of self-inflicted terrorism is the kind of Hail Mary pass that doesn’t matter in the face of an enemy with greater technological firepower. She’s Harren the Black, who was convinced his high walls and impenetrable fortress—Harrenhal—would protect him from Aegon the Conqueror’s dragons. Aegon promised him if he did not surrender on that fateful day that all inside would burn before dawn. Harren and his hall were roasted alive inside their “safe” stones. "
https://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/281068/game-of-thrones-season-8-episode-5-review-the-bells
^^^^
This..
This is why I say it doesn't make sense from episode 5...
From a plausibility stand point... It makes perfect sense for Dany to dive bomb and take out all of the ships full with scorpions... She was angry... She came down fast and she attacked low...
If they never showed Danny fighting the fleet last week and just had Her fleet get slaughtered by the Iron Fleet and their Scorpions... then in this Episode showed Danny take on the entire fleet for the first time.. I would have had some issues, but from a logic standpoint.. I would have nothing to say why this tactic shouldn't work..
but
They showed the exact same thing last week... and had her unable to manage dodging scorpions from a smaller number of ships. So what was it to say that she would be able to have a better shot against a larger number and in a wider formation..
Nothing...
I would have no problems... if they showed a Scene with one of her men sneaking about one of the Iron Fleet ships and caused just enough of a distraction to give her the advantage that she needed.
Maybe a scene in the war room showing them trying to come up with a plan around the scorpions and Dany just angrily shouting at the end of the scene.. All I need is too get low enough... End scene..
Then cut to.... showing Man swimming towards the ship in the cover of night
Next scene battle....
Now you have the one variable that was needed and her destruction of the fleet feels like a earned victory.
Honestly... I think Danny's decent to Mad Queen upon the wall would have worked better if they didn't kill the dragon last week and killed him today... the battle after she lost Missandei ...
The immediate impact of watching her child die right after losing her BFF would have been enough by itself to show her decent to madness.. then they could have used part of the finale to show Dany regretful for what she has done but not apologize putting Jon in the same position that Jaime was in...
"I need to break my loyalty to put down this mad dog for the sake of the kingdom".... Showing her regretful and giving a justification for her belief lapse... would give next weeks episode the nuance that is needs to great a more satisfying conclusion..
But now by doing what they have done.... Dany is full Villian now... She can't be saved..
So now it's going to likely end with a simple good versus evil battle for the throne ......
In this version... Jon winning would be BS.
The only way that I think Season 8 and the series as a whole could retain it's Masterpiece level would to either have Dany win the throne outright ... to show that It truly was her destiny and that the Idea of the throne is linked to a deep history of never ending bloodshed
or they both die...
Leaving the world to actually decide it's own fate and choose it's next king...since most of the old guard is dead..
but then show... that even with this opportunity a clan still feels like they have a claim to the Throne again showing a never ending history of violence to lay claim to a throne that is tainted and distorted.
Denofgeek... noticed the same thing.
I'm just going to quote a section of their review.. other then the fact that I disagree with calling it an ambush since they knew the iron fleet was there last week... They also see my main complaint... With showing the same battle scene back to back..
"The actual tactics of the early portion of the spectacle (before it becomes a massacre) is also more rewarding and satisfying than either of the last two week’s episodes, but therein lies one of several problems with season 8. In just the episode before this, a handful of scorpions were enough to kill Rhagael in an ambush that strained all credulity and common sense. Now this week, the same Daenerys who could not figure out how to strafe around the medieval sailboats with scorpions on only one side of their bows is now comfortable enough with her dragon riding to evade their spears with ease and slaughter both the Iron Fleet and all of the manned walls around King’s Landing in quick succession.
In a nutshell, this beautiful sequence makes me dislike last week’s episode even more than my initially mixed reaction, because this week actually makes plausible sense. The difference, which fans will either be able to reconcile for themselves—or not—is the difference between Benioff and Weiss’ hackneyed plotting and George R.R. Martin’s endgame.
Cersei Lannister is vain and foolish enough to think she has a chance against a dragon. Ignoring how awful the writing was to kill Rhaegal so as to make it seem like Cersei has a fighting chance, this is the delusions of a fool who believed she was every bit as cunning as her father when she became the first secular monarch in centuries to cede power to the church by arming an especially fanatical wing of septons. She managed to pull a miraculous win out of the clutches of defeat by blowing up the Great Sept of Baelor, but that act of self-inflicted terrorism is the kind of Hail Mary pass that doesn’t matter in the face of an enemy with greater technological firepower. She’s Harren the Black, who was convinced his high walls and impenetrable fortress—Harrenhal—would protect him from Aegon the Conqueror’s dragons. Aegon promised him if he did not surrender on that fateful day that all inside would burn before dawn. Harren and his hall were roasted alive inside their “safe” stones. "
https://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/281068/game-of-thrones-season-8-episode-5-review-the-bells
^^^^
This..
This is why I say it doesn't make sense from episode 5...
From a plausibility stand point... It makes perfect sense for Dany to dive bomb and take out all of the ships full with scorpions... She was angry... She came down fast and she attacked low...
If they never showed Danny fighting the fleet last week and just had Her fleet get slaughtered by the Iron Fleet and their Scorpions... then in this Episode showed Danny take on the entire fleet for the first time.. I would have had some issues, but from a logic standpoint.. I would have nothing to say why this tactic shouldn't work..
but
They showed the exact same thing last week... and had her unable to manage dodging scorpions from a smaller number of ships. So what was it to say that she would be able to have a better shot against a larger number and in a wider formation..
Nothing...
I would have no problems... if they showed a Scene with one of her men sneaking about one of the Iron Fleet ships and caused just enough of a distraction to give her the advantage that she needed.
Maybe a scene in the war room showing them trying to come up with a plan around the scorpions and Dany just angrily shouting at the end of the scene.. All I need is too get low enough... End scene..
Then cut to.... showing Man swimming towards the ship in the cover of night
Next scene battle....
Now you have the one variable that was needed and her destruction of the fleet feels like a earned victory.
Honestly... I think Danny's decent to Mad Queen upon the wall would have worked better if they didn't kill the dragon last week and killed him today... the battle after she lost Missandei ...
The immediate impact of watching her child die right after losing her BFF would have been enough by itself to show her decent to madness.. then they could have used part of the finale to show Dany regretful for what she has done but not apologize putting Jon in the same position that Jaime was in...
"I need to break my loyalty to put down this mad dog for the sake of the kingdom".... Showing her regretful and giving a justification for her belief lapse... would give next weeks episode the nuance that is needs to great a more satisfying conclusion..
But now by doing what they have done.... Dany is full Villian now... She can't be saved..
So now it's going to likely end with a simple good versus evil battle for the throne ......
In this version... Jon winning would be BS.
The only way that I think Season 8 and the series as a whole could retain it's Masterpiece level would to either have Dany win the throne outright ... to show that It truly was her destiny and that the Idea of the throne is linked to a deep history of never ending bloodshed
or they both die...
Leaving the world to actually decide it's own fate and choose it's next king...since most of the old guard is dead..
but then show... that even with this opportunity a clan still feels like they have a claim to the Throne again showing a never ending history of violence to lay claim to a throne that is tainted and distorted.
She reminds me of Anakin to Vader. You see the traits even when they do good shit. They can go either way, but need someone or something to keep them from saying'fuck it!!!"
Anakin was a hero to until this...
Then this...
LOL, Dany out fulfilling her friends final wish.
Um......... her father and by extension the Lannister family Killing her mother, father, brother, oh not to mention her grandfather and her uncle .... and the history Targaryen madness. Other than that nothing.
@fonzerrillii and that’s my point. If anything this weeks should make you madder at how weak last weeks was as opposed to mad at this weeks
Damn, Ep 5 was crazy!!...I guess Daenerys said fuck that bell..I'm going to burn this city up!!...She didn't give a fuck!!..She turn all the way crazy!!..
Also, I thought Cersei would have die different than she did!!..Her and Jamie dying like that was kinda wack!!..
The final ep is next Sunday!!..Can't wait!!
Also, I thought Cersei would have die different than she did!!..Her and Jamie dying like that was kinda wack!!..
The final ep is next Sunday!!..Can't wait!!
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Could have been talking about himself tho ..... remember he was all alone.
Trust has to do with intent. Her intent wasn’t to be destructive. It’s just her nature eventually would consume her decision making.
The Point was Euron wanted to be King and he knew that as long as Jamie was alive Cersei would always love Jamie. He planned to kill Jamie and rescue his queen
This i agree..
Ultimately I also think that Jamie was inevitably going to go back to Cersei.... They just could have handled it better.
Maybe not show him so into Brienne and talk about staying with her.... and then in the same episode... showing him going back to Cersi.
Maybe have him hook up with Brienne in Episode 2 after she was knighted and before the Big battle..
then after the battle... when she comes back to him alive.. and after his conversation with Sansa... He realizes that during the battle with the White walkers... while he was fighting for his life.. the only thing he could think about was Cersi..
It would have made sense and added more weight to him leaving Brienne but it would have worked better with the story because in this scenario.. You could say that the battle reignited something in him that he thought was gone ...
But they way it was handled in Episode 4... just didn't make sense cause the Writers went out of their way to show a scene with Jamie and his brother talking about Jamie's new relationship and joking about it. At no time did Jamie show any sign that he was thinking about Cersi... He knew in that conversation with his brother that everyone was planning to now go to Kings Landing. He knew that Cersi sent Bronn to kill him.
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Here's the rewrite we were hoping for
This is exactly what I was thinking.... when she saw Jaime in the chambers leaning....
Dany was like Mick from Rocky, “I didn’t hear no bell!” 
He killed those sand people -- men, women, children, and probably pets -- when he didn't have to. That shit was brutal. Just like this chick, you could see his turn coming even if we didn't know about Vader.
And like I said earlier in the thread, he beheaded count dooku after he was beaten.
That’s the beauty of this show. He could have been talking about himself and others. Double entendre. The viewers don’t know what foreshadowing will occur. The blue eyes, brown eyes, green eyes line gave us a heads up years before. If one takes the time to watch previous seasons without rushing you’ll be surprised at how tied together things are.
I get it
In order for her to be a villain she needed to be born mad and angry and cursing lmao
Cause people can't change right?
People can't grow into madness
People can't inherit mental illness
She needed to not have a heart or be a person to be a villain
It's funny as shit y'all fighting so hard
It just means the writers did a great job cause you didn't believe your eyes
You went with your heart
You trusted her
And you were wrong
But let's not act like that's not possible
Cats are talking about in real life and then ignore mental illness is sometimes genetic and can be passed down lol
Nooooo
She was kind
She came and saved the north cause saving humanity is right
Oh wait she didn't do that
She gave zero fucks about ppl unless they pledged themselves to her
Especially considering the in breeding the Targs did for years it wouldn’t surprise me if mentally being unstable wasn’t a trait of theirs.
So Dany going to the North wasn't purely altruism?! It didn't have anything to do with the fact that if she didn't go North, she'd exponentially decrease her chances of sitting on the Iron Throne? I thought she was just doing House Stark a favor.
When the bitch wouldn't come to Winterfell unless they pledged
When if she would have came without it and fought to save them they would have said she was noble and pledged loyalty to her lol
Dude, what part of... she AMBUSHED Euron and his whole crew... do you not understand?
She caught them slipping. All their sails are up. They are NOT ready for a fight. He has to yell at them to just START to swing their weapons around.
Notice how when shes diving right at them... They could only manage to FIRE ONE SINGLE SHOT before Drogon starts torching the shit outta ALL o’ them.
Last week... these dudes AMBUSHED her. And they had their weapons TRAINED on her long before she even saw her Dragon go down... because it was like SKEET SHOOTING clay pigeons that are moving sideways across your target area. They had 30 guns all ‘locked on’ her ass, practically from jump.
But this week... it’s like they was trying to get dressed while shooting arrows. Nuccas got caught out there. Badly. And paid the price for slipping.
They didn’t have a target lined-up right in front of them... just waiting... like last week. This week, the target was dipping & diving.... and it just kept Blitzing the Quarterbacks before they could even ‘get set’ at the line of scrimmage.
It’s ridiculous that some of y’all even argue this shit.
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The funny part is if she had come without the pledge they would have pledged to her it's literally how Jon got the gig in the first place lol
They had been hinting at her turn from the first season, but because she killing people without mercy that we didn't like then it was fine. The signs were there are all along. She was weak at that time so none of her tyrannical behavior didn't matter.