Why do more white progressives say racism is a major problem than do black people?

[Dannyblueyes]

Do you realize that thru out American history conservatism has been at the heart of all the strife and conflict we've had? yes democrats created the kkk and fought to keep slavery BUT what no one on the right likes to mention is that the GOP during the 1800s was liberal/progressive compared to the Democrats who were decidedly conservative. Here's a political poster from the period

1860s conservative democrat vs the 1860s radical republican...To support abolitionism IS progressive and liberal...to support civil rights for nonwhites IS progressive and liberal. To want to maintain the status quo of how America has worked even as it means other Americans are excluded is conservative. So the mindset of how minorities and others are perceived and treated in a negative way has ALWAYS been how conservatives have acted regardless of whether they were called democrats (the early-mid to late 1800s to mid-1900s) or republicans (from the late 60s to today)

Todays GOP uses the terms liberal and progressive as pejoratives and derogatorily, betraying the liberal/progressive roots of their party while deluding themselves into believing this generation of republicans are like the ones of the 1800s..that's a joke. Saint Reagan wouldn't be considered a good republican by today's standards.

And the ONLY reason we've come so far is because liberals and progressives dragged the conservatives kicking and screaming into the future.

It's always baffled me that the darker America gets the further its policies swing to the right. It gives white Americans a better life than people of color, but nowhere near as good a life as white folks in most of Europe.

It's also coincidence that our most radical leftist presidential candidate is the long standing senator of the whitest state in America. Also, of the 10 states with the highest Black population 9 of them are firmly Republican (And that's only if you count DC as a state).

What that tells me is that white people are capable of being compassionate and progressive so long as there's no one to put under their boot heel. When that changes everything becomes about crackdowns, surveillance, and suspending civil liberties. That is the true sickness of white supremacy.

 

[World B Free]

I understand what they're trying to do. Under the electoral college system breaking up California would essentially turn it purple. Same with breaking up Texas.

With that said, I personally think that the United States should be broken up into separate countries. The federal government is becoming too corrupt, divisive and overwhelmed to properly manage over 300 million people. On top of that almost every sector has competing economic interests. A federal law that might work well for the automotive industry might cripple the agriculture industry and give unintended loopholes to the the banking industry and so forth. Having everything under one roof slows down economic progress.

As for social progress, most of the things that Warren and Sanders talk about have already been done on city and country levels. San Francisco has a $15 minimum wage and free college. New York City has universal healthcare. Several states have legalized or decriminalized marijuana, etc. Again, the problem is that there's too much corruption and too many competing interests for any of these things to get resolved at the federal level.

It's gotten so bad that almost all of our legislation is passed by the judicial branch. Nine elderly men and women with lifetime appointments have more power to make changes than all of our elected officials combined. It's become one of the most undemocratic systems ever spawned.

Most of all, this model is already working in Europe and Asia, especially in the former Soviet Union.

Imagine what would happen if the USA functioned more like the EU. California and Texas are their own countries. New York is a city state akin to Singapore. The rust belt states have merged and passed laws to revive their factories. The South and Midwest have followed the Danish model and made their agricultural system profitable again.

The dollar still exists, but new countries are able to make their own currencies as well. People are also free to travel and live freely within the land. There's still a US military, but each state decides whether or not to send their troops to a particular campaign. the constitution is reduced to its most basic human rights while each new country gets to fill in the rest and decide how their government is going to be structured.

Let's not be naive, if the United States were to broken up, it would be to the detriment of Black & Brown people. You forgot that quickly how White Supremacy works. This isn't a game, it is real life. That's why non-Whites have to take every threat seriously, because our lives are in danger. We know what is currently happening in the Israel project; the White Supremacists in America are taking notes & are providing aid to that racist regime.

& you still trust America to be fair; there is 400 years of evidence to counter the idea that American will be fair with any changes that White people in power will make.

 

[geechiedan]

I said this in another current post, conservative and liberal are just labels that people put on one another and the meanings change over time. I'm well aware of the changing roles of the parties. At it's most basic, Conservatism is to be for small government. Many black people are for small government. We want Government out of our lives. Remember it was government that imposed Jim Crow and enforced segregation. Those are the actions of a big government. Black people are reluctant to change, we have patience and like change in increments. White progressives want massive change now.

The poster is kind of misleading. The Republican party that freed the slaves was Conservative and were for free markets. They were called Radical because they wanted to free the slaves but it was a party of limited government. It takes big government to deprive someone of their God-given freedom. The GOP was founded in the 1850's when the Whig Party dissolved after the Kansas-Nebraska Act. The party drew from both the Whigs and Democrats who opposed slavery. Prior to the Civil War, the Whigs and Democrats were national parties, mixed throughout the North and South. The sectional parties are a legacy from slavery.

Many black people have Conservative views, the problem is the conservative movement has been corrupted by racism. White people love government, they just want the government to maintain white supremacy, such as Jim Crow.The base never of the GOP never really wanted limited government. They were willing to support tax cuts for the wealthy in exchange for the funding for their race war.

The conundrum of being black in America is that while you hold conservative views and say small govt, small govt, small govt the reality is that it took an act of govt to not just start but to STOP that shit as well... it was an act of govt that desegregated the military and ended formal discrimination in the workplace...its the reason why the black middle class was built on state and federal govt jobs. Govt had to send the national guard to stop cacs from rioting on 9 black kids going to school in Arkansas etc...The civil rights struggle wouldn't have worked without govt intervention...all of these things good and bad are acts of govt you aren't getting around that.

And I WHOLLY disagree that black people want slow change....thats not what MLK talked about nor Malcolm X nor any radical leader. Blacks may be conservative but how that looks and functions is not the same as white conservatives.

Many black people have Conservative views, the problem is the conservative movement has been corrupted by racism.

corrupted by racism??? the conservative movement in America IS racism...glove and hand..something can't be corrupted if it was designed that way.

 

[Dannyblueyes]

Let's not be naive, if the United States were to broken up, it would be to the detriment of Black & Brown people. You forgot that quickly how White Supremacy works. This isn't a game, it is real life. That's why non-Whites have to take every threat seriously, because our lives are in danger. We know what is currently happening in the Israel project; the White Supremacists in America are taking notes & are providing aid to that racist regime.

& you still trust America to be fair; there is 400 years of evidence to counter the idea that American will be fair with any changes that White people in power will make.

The reason I want the country broke up is precisely because I don't trust America to be fair. And how could separate countries possibly be more detrimental to Black and Brown people than the United States already is?

As for Israel, right now the entire government has voted to provide aid and take notes. What if a state had the ability to opt out?

 

[World B Free]

The reason I want the country broke up is precisely because I don't trust America to be fair. And how could separate countries possibly be more detrimental to Black and Brown people than the United States already is?

As for Israel, right now the entire government has voted to provide aid and take notes. What if a state had the ability to opt out?

Dannyblueyes, this American project is not your wish-fulfillment machine, I'm speaking from the history of the United States not my wishes. I guess you don't understand the extent the White Supremacists will do to stay in power, this is not a game ~~ that's is what you don't understand. & I only mentioned Israel because it's a project for apartheid whose elements can be brought over here and instituted: Israel could be the future of the United States. It's always been a White Supremacist settler state who cared nothing about the Brown & Black people in that country & they cared nothing about Brown & Black people outside of that country. They even supported apartheid in South Africa.

 

[rude_dog]

The conundrum of being black in America is that while you hold conservative views and say small govt, small govt, small govt the reality is that it took an act of govt to not just start but to STOP that shit as well... it was an act of govt that desegregated the military and ended formal discrimination in the workplace...its the reason why the black middle class was built on state and federal govt jobs. Govt had to send the national guard to stop cacs from rioting on 9 black kids going to school in Arkansas etc...The civil rights struggle wouldn't have worked without govt intervention...all of these things good and bad are acts of govt you aren't getting around that.

And I WHOLLY disagree that black people want slow change....thats not what MLK talked about nor Malcolm X nor any radical leader. Blacks may be conservative but how that looks and functions is not the same as white conservatives.



corrupted by racism??? the conservative movement in America IS racism...glove and hand..something can't be corrupted if it was designed that way.

You are correct. The conservative movement in America is racist. But there is nothing wrong with a conservative philosophy. We should have debates about the size of government. There are conservatives in Africa and Latin American countries. Again, the problem is that conservatism has been corrupted by racism. The GOP base has exchanged their votes for the funding of their race war.

For the record, I'm a democrat. I have liberal views and I have conservative views. I don't want the government infringing on my morals. If I want to smoke a joint in my backyard, I should be able too. If I'm stupid enough to bet on the Detroit Lions, that's my business. If I want to pay an attractive young lady to look in my eyes and tell me she loves me, that's between me and her, not the government. I also want clean water and air. I want medicine that won't cause greater harm. I want food that has been inspected. I like a livable minimum wage. I would like everyone to have access to healthcare that doesn't effect my Cadillac care.

Yes, Black people want equality now but MLK preached patience. Wasn't it him he said the Arc of Justice is long? If we weren't patient, why aren't the streets like Baghdad or Kabul? We lived through 250 years of slavery, 100 years of segregation and Jim Crow, Colfax, Tulsa and lynchings. If we aren't patient, what are we?

 

[geechiedan]

You are correct. The conservative movement in America is racist. But there is nothing wrong with a conservative philosophy. We should have debates about the size of government. There are conservatives in Africa and Latin American countries. Again, the problem is that conservatism has been corrupted by racism. The GOP base has exchanged their votes for the funding of their race war.

For the record, I'm a democrat. I have liberal views and I have conservative views. I don't want the government infringing on my morals. If I want to smoke a joint in my backyard, I should be able too. If I'm stupid enough to bet on the Detroit Lions, that's my business. If I want to pay an attractive young lady to look in my eyes and tell me she loves me, that's between me and her, not the government. I also want clean water and air. I want medicine that won't cause greater harm. I want food that has been inspected. I like a livable minimum wage. I would like everyone to have access to healthcare that doesn't effect my Cadillac care.

Yes, Black people want equality now . MLK preached patience. If we weren't patient, why aren't the streets like Baghdad or Kabul? We lived through 250 years of slavery, 100 years of segregation and Jim Crow, Colfax, Tulsa and lynchings. If we aren't patient, what are we?

MLK preached nonviolence not patience theres a difference.

 

[Dannyblueyes]

Dannyblueyes, this American project is not your wish-fulfillment machine, I'm speaking from the history of the United States not my wishes. I guess you don't understand the extent the White Supremacists will do to stay in power, this is not a game ~~ that's is what you don't understand. & I only mentioned Israel because it's a project for apartheid whose elements can be brought over here and instituted: Israel could be the future of the United States. It's always been a White Supremacist settler state who cared nothing about the Brown & Black people in that country & they cared nothing about Brown & Black people outside of that country. They even supported apartheid in South Africa.

It's not the lust for power I question, it's their unity. keep in mind that this is the same country that liberated the concentration camps with a segregated army while interning Japanese Americans at the same time. White supremacy is no more monolithic than Christianity is.

and while I do think it would be advantageous to break up the United States into smaller countries, I don't see it as wish-fulfillment. I see it as an inevitable result of America trying to adapt to a changing world.

 

[World B Free]

It's not the lust for power I question, it's their unity. keep in mind that this is the same country that liberated the concentration camps with a segregated army while interning Japanese Americans at the same time. White supremacy is no more monolithic than Christianity is.

and while I do think it would be advantageous to break up the United States into smaller countries, I don't see it as wish-fulfillment. I see it as an inevitable result of America trying to adapt to a changing world.

The problem is that you don't have any stakes in the game, you're speaking from protected mode while I'm speaking about Black survival. I think we're speaking from two different places, you're talking about esoteric notions of America being fair on its own accord (by breaking up the United States) while I'm speaking on the history of White Supremacy in America which is soaked in blood, it's deep in the soil. This is not a game to me.

Plus, you're talking about the different types of White Supremacy, that's a luxury even to talk about the various levels of White Supremacy ~~~ it's all one oppression to Black people. It all goes in the same waste bin.

 

[ansatsusha_gouki]

The problem is that you don't have any stakes in the game, you're speaking from protected mode while I'm speaking about Black survival. I think we're speaking from two different places, you're talking about esoteric notions of America being fair on its own accord (by breaking up the United States) while I'm speaking on the history of White Supremacy in America which is soaked in blood, it's deep in the soil. This is not a game to me.

Plus, you're talking about the different types of White Supremacy, that's a luxury even to talk about the various levels of White Supremacy ~~~ it's all one oppression to Black people. It all goes in the same waste bin.

This is,why I don't waste my time with white folks when discussing white supremacy..

 

[World B Free]

This is,why I don't waste my time with white folks when discussing white supremacy..

Yeah, man, it's a trip......I hear you

 

[ORIGINAL NATION]

Only and only total separation will give the masses a chance at real freedom. Only a devil can create a devil and only a God can create a God.

 

[Dannyblueyes]

The problem is that you don't have any stakes in the game, you're speaking from protected mode while I'm speaking about Black survival. I think we're speaking from two different places, you're talking about esoteric notions of America being fair on its own accord (by breaking up the United States) while I'm speaking on the history of White Supremacy in America which is soaked in blood, it's deep in the soil. This is not a game to me.

Plus, you're talking about the different types of White Supremacy, that's a luxury even to talk about the various levels of White Supremacy ~~~ it's all one oppression to Black people. It all goes in the same waste bin.

I never once mentioned fairness in our conversation. In fact the words 'fair' and 'United States' don't even belong in the same sentence. When I talk about breaking up the country it's an inevitable means of survival. Same way the British had to break up its empire to survive.

As far as having the stake in the game, I may not deal with the same prejudice and systemic racism that you do, but if you look through my family tree the Africans aren't that hard to find. Right now it doesn't make any difference in how I'm treated, but in 1930 the Germans didn't care if you had a Jewish grandfather either. I'm not foolish enough to think that history won't repeat itself.
There are no different levels of white supremacy, it's about different modes of the same system. learning how to adapt and work around these modes is not a luxury, it's a necessity. If you can't figure out how each mode works you'll never be able to get it anywhere near the dustbin.

 

[Rembrandt Brown]

You are correct. The conservative movement in America is racist. But there is nothing wrong with a conservative philosophy. We should have debates about the size of government. There are conservatives in Africa and Latin American countries. Again, the problem is that conservatism has been corrupted by racism. The GOP base has exchanged their votes for the funding of their race war.

For the record, I'm a democrat. I have liberal views and I have conservative views. I don't want the government infringing on my morals. If I want to smoke a joint in my backyard, I should be able too. If I'm stupid enough to bet on the Detroit Lions, that's my business. If I want to pay an attractive young lady to look in my eyes and tell me she loves me, that's between me and her, not the government. I also want clean water and air. I want medicine that won't cause greater harm. I want food that has been inspected. I like a livable minimum wage. I would like everyone to have access to healthcare that doesn't effect my Cadillac care.

Yes, Black people want equality now but MLK preached patience. Wasn't it him he said the Arc of Justice is long? If we weren't patient, why aren't the streets like Baghdad or Kabul? We lived through 250 years of slavery, 100 years of segregation and Jim Crow, Colfax, Tulsa and lynchings. If we aren't patient, what are we?

MLK preached nonviolence not patience theres a difference.

These motherfuckers who shit on King and don't bother to learn who he is ought to be fucking ashamed.

@rude_dog Google "The fierce urgency of now." Do it NOW. With fierce urgency. You could not be more wrong.

 

[World B Free]

I never once mentioned fairness in our conversation. In fact the words 'fair' and 'United States' don't even belong in the same sentence. When I talk about breaking up the country it's an inevitable means of survival. Same way the British had to break up its empire to survive.

As far as having the stake in the game, I may not deal with the same prejudice and systemic racism that you do, but if you look through my family tree the Africans aren't that hard to find. Right now it doesn't make any difference in how I'm treated, but in 1930 the Germans didn't care if you had a Jewish grandfather either. I'm not foolish enough to think that history won't repeat itself.
There are no different levels of white supremacy, it's about different modes of the same system. learning how to adapt and work around these modes is not a luxury, it's a necessity. If you can't figure out how each mode works you'll never be able to get it anywhere near the dustbin.

Homie, you're not Black, that's why you're constantly bringing up Jews and Germany; the African Holocaust predated the Jewish Holocaust and the African Holocaust was based on skin color alone. & you having a Black distant relative doesn't matter, when push comes to shove you'll be on that train labeled for White People and I'll be on that train labeled for Black people, let's be real. & you said "White supremacy is no more monolithic than Christianity is," that infers that there are different types of White Supremacy I should be familiar with....lol, you don't get it!! I've been BLACK all of MY LIFE, I know White Supremacy intimately and you're speaking from high perch telling me how to adapt to it: what is wrong with you? Why are you telling a Black Person how to adapt to White Supremacy? huh? You really don't understand what it is to be Black, you don't understand the mental violence put upon Black folks on a daily basis, & you're trying to educate me? How dare you!

 

[Dannyblueyes]

Homie, you're not Black, that's why you're constantly bringing up Jews and Germany; the African Holocaust predated the Jewish Holocaust and the African Holocaust was based on skin color alone. & you having a Black distant relative doesn't matter, when push comes to shove, you'll be on that train labeled for White People and I'll be on that train labeled for Black people, let's be real. & you said "White supremacy is no more monolithic than Christianity is," that infers that there are different types of White Supremacy I should be familiar with....lol, you don't get it!! I've been BLACK all of MY LIFE, I know White Supremacy intimately and you're speaking from high perch telling me how to adapt to it: what is wrong with you? Why are you telling a Black Person how to adapt to White Supremacy? huh? You really don't understand what it is to be Black, you don't understand the mental violence put upon Black folks on a daily basis, & you're trying to educate me? How dare you!

So the one drop rule is based on skin color alone? Miss me with that. Shit goes down we're on the same train period. I'm not talkin about that 2% Cameroon on everyone's 23andMe test here.

and while I may not understand what it is to be Black I do understand what it is to deal with white supremacy. Because believe it or not it makes white lives miserable too. Certainly not to the same degree it does yours but it is the reason we have terrorists shooting up white schools, a militarized police force, weak labor unions, kids getting sold to private prisons for kickbacks, and that's just what comes to mind at the moment.

So yeah. You tell me how you adapt, I'll tell you how I adapt and maybe together we can figure a way to survive long enough to shut this shit down once and for good

 

[World B Free]

So the one drop rule is based on skin color alone? Miss me with that. Shit goes down we're on the same train period. I'm not talkin about that 2% Cameroon on everyone's 23andMe test here.

and while I may not understand what it is to be Black I do understand what it is to deal with white supremacy. Because believe it or not it makes white lives miserable too. Certainly not to the same degree it does yours but it is the reason we have terrorists shooting up white schools, a militarized police force, weak labor unions, kids getting sold to private prisons for kickbacks, and that's just what comes to mind at the moment.

So yeah. You tell me how you adapt, I'll tell you how I adapt and maybe together we can figure a way to survive long enough to shut this shit down once and for good

What are you talking about "so the drop rule is based on skin color alone"? You are White!!!! You're on the White Train! In this society, you have advantages of Whiteness. Why can't you see that? People are not going to take your DNA test wherever you are to determine that you have a Black distant relative, it doesn't matter: YOU'RE WHITE!!!! & then you say "I may not understand what it is to be Black," you're talking out of both sides of your mouth. First you say we're on the same Black train, then you say I don't know what it is to be Black. What are you really saying?

& you're talking about litany of why White lives are miserable, & you're comparing that to Black lives: so White privilege is miserable? Having every advantage of the society is miserable? huh? & you're comparing that to Black lives? C'mon Man. Really?

 

[rude_dog]

These motherfuckers who shit on King and don't bother to learn who he is ought to be fucking ashamed.

@rude_dog Google "The fierce urgency of now." Do it NOW. With fierce urgency. You could not be more wrong.

No wonder we can’t get along with others when we can’t get along with one another. I maintain, similar to Malcolm X, that anyone who is advocating for non-violence is advocating patience. It doesn’t mean our patience is unlimited. Patience doesn’t mean sitting around not doing anything and waiting your turn. Patient can mean understanding that things take time.

I would suggest you read Letters from Birmingham Jail in which MLK writes that he had been told “wait” for years. If he hadn’t been patient for years, how was he hearing “wait” for years? He would have been throwing pipe bombs. You want to argue about a sense of urgency. Urgent to you may mean an hour, urgent to someone else may mean tomorrow.

Rembrandt X, you ask a question and I give you an opinion and you throw insults? MLK was frequently criticized zed for being too patient.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

Still laughing at the premise that white progressives see racism as more of a problem than the people who it actually affects


Lol


Lions are more concerned for zebras safety than zebras


Zebras see no problem with what lions are doing to zebras

 

[Dannyblueyes]

What are you talking about "so the drop rule is based on skin color alone"? You are White!!!! You're on the White Train! In this society, you have advantages of Whiteness. Why can't you see that? People are not going to take your DNA test wherever you are to determine that you have a Black distant relative, it doesn't matter: YOU'RE WHITE!!!! & then you say "I may not understand what it is to be Black," you're talking out of both sides of your mouth. First you say we're on the same Black train, then you say I don't know what it is to be Black. What are you really saying?

& you're talking about litany of why White lives are miserable, & you're comparing that to Black lives: so White privilege is miserable? Having every advantage of the society is miserable? huh? & you're comparing that to Black lives? C'mon Man. Really?

I'm what they used to call an octoroon. I look white, was raised in a white neighborhood and that spared me from the shared trauma Black people go through.

However, under white supremacy looking the part isn't always good enough. Eventually they're going to come for you and pull that white card right out of your pocket. When that happens all the MAGA chants in the world won't save you.

And yes, compared to Black people white Americans have it good. Compared to most of Europe though we don't have shit. As for advantage in society, white American upward mobility ranking is almost as bad as its health and education rankings and it's falling by the day. What's worse is that even if you took people of color completely out of the equation America would still have the highest incarceration rate in the world by far.

if white supremacy was really doing us any favors American whites would have the highest standard of living in the world. Instead it's the main thing holding us back.

So why tell you And not white people this? Let's just say I'm tired of being called crazy.

 

[World B Free]

I'm what they used to call an octoroon. I look white, was raised in a white neighborhood and that spared me from the shared trauma Black people go through.

However, under white supremacy looking the part isn't always good enough. Eventually they're going to come for you and pull that white card right out of your pocket. When that happens all the MAGA chants in the world won't save you.

And yes, compared to Black people white Americans have it good. Compared to most of Europe though we don't have shit. As for advantage in society, white American upward mobility ranking is almost as bad as its health and education rankings and it's falling by the day. What's worse is that even if you took people of color completely out of the equation America would still have the highest incarceration rate in the world by far.

if white supremacy was really doing us any favors American whites would have the highest standard of living in the world. Instead it's the main thing holding us back.

So why tell you And not white people this? Let's just say I'm tired of being called crazy.

Homie, you're White and you have all the advantages of Whiteness. & for the prison population, why the prison population is so high is because it was a war on Black people aka The War on Drugs. Most of those White people in prison are just because of the collateral damage of a racist system attacking Black people.

& you said "if white supremacy was doing us any favors American whites would have the highest standard of living in the world," what does that have to with anything? So you're saying the American brand of White Supremacy is not the best brand of White Supremacy? lol....what are you really saying? Any advantage of Whiteness to the majority of Black people is criminal, your Whiteness erases of the benefit of doubt in most situations? Isn't that enough? Your Whiteness doesn't get you followed in stores and it doesn't get you the openly hostile reaction by a White police officer, more than likely they'll view you as non-threatening. Also, being White helps in securing an apartment, a mortgage, and with gainful employment, isn't that enough? Really, how much White privilege do you want? Now you want the White privilege and the standard of living in Europe? ...lol. Come on, Son!!!

 

[Dannyblueyes]

Homie, you're White and you have all the advantages of Whiteness. & for the prison population, why the prison population is so high is because it was a war on Black people aka The War on Drugs. Most of those White people in prison are just the collateral damage of a racist system attacking Black people.

& you said "if white supremacy was doing us any favors American whites would have the highest standard of living in the world," what does that have to with anything? So you're saying the American brand of White Supremacy is not the best brand of White Supremacy? lol....what are you really saying? Any advantage of Whiteness to the majority of Black people is criminal, your Whiteness erases of the benefit of doubt in most situations? Isn't that enough? Your Whiteness doesn't get you followed in stores and it doesn't get you the openly hostile reaction by a White police officer, more than likely they'll view you as non-threatening. Also, being White helps in securing an apartment, a mortgage, and with gainful employment, isn't that enough? Really, how much White privilege do you want? Now you want the White privilege and the standard of living in Europe? ...lol. Come on, Son!!!

Not getting followed in stores, not having openly hostile reactions from police, being able to get an apartment, mortgage and gainful employment, getting the benefit of the doubt, not automatically being thought of as a threat?

Practically EVERYONE on the planet gets these things. America is just so fucked up that basic human dignity is considered a privilege.

So yeah, I do want more than that. More for me, you, everyone, even my enemies deserve better than that.

So what am I really saying about standard of living? It's just like you said. Most white people are suffering the collateral damage of racism. Most European countries don't because there's no one there to be racist against. America will never be an all white country nor would I ever want it to be. Instead we just need to stop being racist. it's certainly not easy, but it is that simple.

 

[World B Free]

Not getting followed in stores, not having openly hostile reactions from police, being able to get an apartment, mortgage and gainful employment, getting the benefit of the doubt, not automatically being thought of as a threat?

Practically EVERYONE on the planet gets these things. America is just so fucked up that basic human dignity is considered a privilege.

So yeah, I do want more than that. More for me, you, everyone, even my enemies deserve better than that.

So what am I really saying about standard of living? It's just like you said. Most white people are suffering the collateral damage of racism. Most European countries don't because there's no one there to be racist against. America will never be an all white country nor would I ever want it to be. Instead we just need to stop being racist. it's certainly not easy, but it is that simple.

"Practically EVERYONE on the planet gets these things"......What does that even mean? What does everyone get?

Oh & the collateral damage is not worse than the intended damage for Black people, you can't equate the two.

 

[Dannyblueyes]

"Practically EVERYONE on the planet gets these things"......What does that even mean? What does everyone get?

Oh & the collateral damage is not worse than the intended damage for Black people, you can't equate the two.

What I mean is that if your a Chinese person walking through a store in China nobody is going to follow you based on how you look. An Indian can get a mortgage for any home in India that he can afford. If a Nigerian applies for gainful employment in Nigeria the only question will be whether or not he's qualified.

In those countries, as with most, these things are not considered privileges. They're considered basic human dignity. Facts of Life. Yet in America, not only are they considered privileges, they are thought to be every advantage that a society could possibly offer.

This is because white supremacy has caused all of us to set an incredibly low bar on how we're treated and how we treat each other.

And no, I never tried to compare collateral damage with how Black people are treated. I will compare it to how the rest of the world treats its people though. It's the best way to show that white supremacy hurts it's own too.

 

[World B Free]

What I mean is that if your a Chinese person walking through a store in China nobody is going to follow you based on how you look. An Indian can get a mortgage for any home in India that he can afford. If a Nigerian applies for gainful employment in Nigeria the only question will be whether or not he's qualified.

In those countries, as with most, these things are not considered privileges. They're considered basic human dignity. Facts of Life. Yet in America, not only are they considered privileges, they are thought to be every advantage that a society could possibly offer.

This is because white supremacy has caused all of us to set an incredibly low bar on how we're treated and how we treat each other.

And no, I never tried to compare collateral damage with how Black people are treated. I will compare it to how the rest of the world treats its people though. It's the best way to show that white supremacy hurts it's own too.

I guess what you're not understanding is that White Supremacy in all encompassing, I only gave you of some of the indignities of White Supremacy that I would encounter in the United States. White Supremacy, also, affected Nigeria, India, & China, they were all colonized by the British in some form & the legacies of that colonization are still affecting the countries negatively today. The system of White Supremacy is global and wide-spread & it acts to undermine the self-determination of non-White countries through his usage of the World Bank, the IMF, and the intelligent agencies such as the CIA & the UK's MI5.

 

[Dannyblueyes]

I guess what you're not understanding is that White Supremacy in all encompassing, I only gave you of some of the indignities of White Supremacy that I would encounter in the United States. White Supremacy, also, affected Nigeria, India, & China, they were all colonized by the British in some form & the legacies of that colonization are still affecting the countries negatively today. The system of White Supremacy is global and wide-spread & it acts to undermine the self-determination of non-White countries through his usage of the World Bank, the IMF, and the intelligent agencies such as the CIA & the UK's MI5.

While I'm not clear on all of the particulars I am well aware that White Supremacy is a global problem. What makes America rare is that it was one of the few countries where the Europeans outnumbered people of color. What makes it unique is that it is the only country where Europeans deliberately increased their numbers after slavery ended.

When the British ended slavery in 1835 most white people got the hell out of the colonies. The few that stayed were usually prisoners or low ranking soldiers. People who had little to no power. White supremacy largely functioned as an invisible hand that pulled strings behind the scenes while the people went about their daily business.

In America though, everyone stayed including the aristocratic class. They've been trying to reintroduce slavery in one form or another ever since. What I want white people to understand is that this is being done for THEIR benefit, not yours. When they encourage you to hate someone who doesn't look like you it's really a slight of hand to take the focus off of them.

Also, when white people "accomplish" something such as buying a house, getting gainful employment, starting a business, or finishing college I want them to ask two questions 1) "Would I have been able to do this if I were Black?" and 2) "Would I have been able to do this in Sweden?" The first question acknowledges white supremacy's existence and the second acknowledges that it's really not doing you any favors.

 

[World B Free]

While I'm not clear on all of the particulars I am well aware that White Supremacy is a global problem. What makes America rare is that it was one of the few countries where the Europeans outnumbered people of color. What makes it unique is that it is the only country where Europeans deliberately increased their numbers after slavery ended.

When the British ended slavery in 1835 most white people got the hell out of the colonies. The few that stayed were usually prisoners or low ranking soldiers. People who had little to no power. White supremacy largely functioned as an invisible hand that pulled strings behind the scenes while the people went about their daily business.

In America though, everyone stayed including the aristocratic class. They've been trying to reintroduce slavery in one form or another ever since. What I want white people to understand is that this is being done for THEIR benefit, not yours. When they encourage you to hate someone who doesn't look like you it's really a slight of hand to take the focus off of them.

Also, when white people "accomplish" something such as buying a house, getting gainful employment, starting a business, or finishing college I want them to ask two questions 1) "Would I have been able to do this if I were Black?" and 2) "Would I have been able to do this in Sweden?" The first question acknowledges white supremacy's existence and the second acknowledges that it's really not doing you any favors.

I think you willfully ignore the power of White Supremacy, you gloss over what White Supremacy has done to people: the culture it's destroyed, the violence it has meted out and the destruction its doing today. I mentioned the British in the first place because you mentioned: China, India, and Nigeria & I said they were all colonized by the British in some from. Then you go on a diatribe and say "When the British ended slavery in 1835 most white people got the hell out of the colonies." White people are not just British, here are a list of some of the European countries with colonies in Africa alone not counting the British:

1. France (Chad) (Algeria) (Guinea) (Algeria)(Comoros) (Madagascar) (Mali)(Ivory Coast)(Senegal)(Tunisia)(Gabon)(Togo)
2. Belgium (Congo) (Rawanda & Burundi)
3. Germany (Namibia) (Cameroon & Nigeria~Kamerun)
4. Italy (Eritrea)(Somaliland)(Libya)
5. Netheralands (Ghana)(Senegal -Goree)(Sao Tome)(French Seychelles)
6. Portugal(Angola)(Cape Verde)(Morocco)(Lagos, Nigeria area) (Mozmbique) (Portuguese Gold Coast) (Zanzibar) (Sao Tome & Principe)
7. Spain (Bono) (Bougie)(Jerba)(Rio Muni)(Spanish West Africa)
8. Sweden (Swedish Gold Coast)

& this is an incomplete list from Africa, there are no Asian countries on there, & there isn't Australia/New Zealand/Tasmania. Also there isn't countries from the Caribbean. This is how White Supremacy has affected the world and is still affecting the world. & you say that after 1835 " [white]People who had little to no power," The Namibian Genocide happened in 1904-1908 over 100,000 were murdered & the Germans had 'little to no power." King Leopold from Belgium ruled from 1865 - 1909, his colonial regime murdered over 10 million Africans in The Congo, now is that "little to no power."

I could go on & on, but it's not my job to educate you. I don't think you understand what White people have done to this world or maybe you don't want to learn, because you should know about the King Leopold and the Namibian Genocide. Hell, you should know about the Tasmanian Genocide, also, where White people murdered a whole country of people, destroyed a people and a culture.

Man, you have to read more.

 

[Dannyblueyes]

I think you willfully ignore the power of White Supremacy, you gloss over what White Supremacy has done to people: the culture it's destroyed, the violence it has meted out and the destruction its doing today. I mentioned the British in the first place because you mentioned: China, India, and Nigeria & I said they were all colonized by the British in some from. Then you go on a diatribe and say "When the British ended slavery in 1835 most white people got the hell out of the colonies." White people are not just British, here are a list of some of the European countries with colonies in Africa alone not counting the British:

1. France (Chad) (Algeria) (Guinea) (Algeria)(Comoros) (Madagascar) (Mali)(Ivory Coast)(Senegal)(Tunisia)(Gabon)(Togo)
2. Belgium (Congo) (Rawanda & Burundi)
3. Germany (Namibia) (Cameroon & Nigeria~Kamerun)
4. Italy (Eritrea)(Somaliland)(Libya)
5. Netheralands (Ghana)(Senegal -Goree)(Sao Tome)(French Seychelles)
6. Portugal(Angola)(Cape Verde)(Morocco)(Lagos, Nigeria area) (Mozmbique) (Portuguese Gold Coast) (Zanzibar) (Sao Tome & Principe)
7. Spain (Bono) (Bougie)(Jerba)(Rio Muni)(Spanish West Africa)
8. Sweden (Swedish Gold Coast)

& this is an incomplete list from Africa, there are no Asian countries on there, & there isn't Australia/New Zealand/Tasmania. Also there isn't countries from the Caribbean. This is how White Supremacy has affected the world and is still affecting the world. & you say that after 1835 " [white]People who had little to no power," The Namibian Genocide happened in 1904-1908 over 100,000 were murdered & the Germans had 'little to no power." King Leopold from Belgium ruled from 1865 - 1909, his colonial regime murdered over 10 million Africans in The Congo, now is that "little to no power."

I could go on & on, but it's not my job to educate you. I don't think you understand what White people have done to this world or maybe you don't want to learn, because you should know about the King Leopold and the Namibian Genocide. Hell, you should know about the Tasmanian Genocide, also, where White people murdered a whole country of people, destroyed a people and a culture.

Man, you have to read more.

You certainly know more about this than I do, but I do know that even simply documenting white crimes of the past 200 years would take us the better part of a month.

When I said white people with "little or no power" I was referring to the white people who permanently settled in these countries. Not invading armies who slaughtered and went home. Not tyrants who ruled from a palace thousands of miles away. In many of the countries you just mentioned there are people who go their entire lives without ever seeing a white person in the flesh and this is a profound difference from how things are in the United States.

The biggest difference is that most of these European powers eventually more or less abandoned their colonies for one reason or another. Either they successfully won their freedom (India or Haiti), the colonizing country became too weak to control them (Italy), or white people wouldn't settle there (Most of West Africa). I won't deny that European's past atrocities still have a huge impact on these nations. I certainly won't negate the effect of today's economic hitmen, but by and large the damage has been done and the people were left to their own devices in their day to day lives.

In America however, the colonists still live in the country and are hellbent on bringing back chattel slavery in one form or another. They use all nature of lies, fear and trickery to try to get every white person in this nation to side with them, even to our own detriment. We even have a president who offers executive cover for civil war crimes against people of color and any white folks that speak out on their behalf.

 

[World B Free]

You certainly know more about this than I do, but I do know that even simply documenting white crimes of the past 200 years would take us the better part of a month.

When I said white people with "little or no power" I was referring to the white people who permanently settled in these countries. Not invading armies who slaughtered and went home. Not tyrants who ruled from a palace thousands of miles away. In many of the countries you just mentioned there are people who go their entire lives without ever seeing a white person in the flesh and this is a profound difference from how things are in the United States.

The biggest difference is that most of these European powers eventually more or less abandoned their colonies for one reason or another. Either they successfully won their freedom (India or Haiti), the colonizing country became too weak to control them (Italy), or white people wouldn't settle there (Most of West Africa). I won't deny that European's past atrocities still have a huge impact on these nations. I certainly won't negate the effect of today's economic hitmen, but by and large the damage has been done and the people were left to their own devices in their day to day lives.

In America however, the colonists still live in the country and are hellbent on bringing back chattel slavery in one form or another. They use all nature of lies, fear and trickery to try to get every white person in this nation to side with them, even to our own detriment. We even have a president who offers executive cover for civil war crimes against people of color and any white folks that speak out on their behalf.

Dannyblueyes, White Supremacy isn't dependent on White people permanently settling in on a place; White Supremacy is White People controlling a government and natural resources of a country, White people do not have to live in that country to do that. They can control that country through the World Bank, IMF policies, through Multi-National corporations, through the CIA, and through puppet regimes. So when you make the comparison to the United States it's baseless, because it's all White Supremacy.

 

[hardawayz16]

Dannyblueyes, White Supremacy isn't dependent on White people permanently settling in on a place; White Supremacy is White People controlling a government and natural resources of a country, White people do not have to live in that country to do that. They can control that country through the World Bank, IMF policies, through Multi-National corporations, through the CIA, and through puppet regimes. So when you make the comparison to the United States it's baseless, because it's all White Supremacy.

You must be a lot of fun at parties

 

[totto]

LOL @ the Stugotz denouement.

If you talk to anybody who has worked in voter turnout, educated white people are the last group we have to worry about voting and they're largely anti-Trump. Obviously the progressive ones are going to vote that way.

It's the non-college educated white people and the white conservatives/rich people who are the problem in the booth.

As Famous1 pointed out, a main problem with the statistics in this conversation is they lump all black people together. I'm less interested in the black liberal/conservative split because, whatever social conservative inclinations may exist, black people very decidedly do not vote for conservatives. I'd be more interested in a breakdown of black views based on education-level and income-levels.

Edited to add: And by age! That might be the most important distinction.

Are you sure about this? Most white men I know who make decent money are low key republican, even the ones who act down and cool.

I didn't read much of you OP because I honestly don't see any point digging that deep into it, people naturally want to hold onto the power that they have so "Progressives, Leftist" or whatever is the same thing.

We as black folks have no friends regardless.

I think you're pretty left leaning so alot of what I say is gonna anger you or you may call me militant but IMO White "Progressives" vote left and want more "racial diversity" because they simply make money off it, opens up to areas to create more income.

Turn on TV and Oprah is a brand, all types of stuff, you got Asian families having their own TV show now, it's just about the money.

Remember



That's really all their is to it.

 

[kogalee-muhammad]

Dude, you were flat-out fucking wrong. There's no source backing up your misinformed claim. The reason I posted the Google link is literally every source contradicts you.

It's okay to be wrong. Admit it when you are and thank the person who educates you. I do it all the time.



"White progressives"

So you just want to be intentionally dishonest now? You're not that stupid.

Do you thank the Honorable Elijah Muhammad, too?

 

[World B Free]

You must be a lot of fun at parties

Your comment makes no sense & it's not witty.

 

[Rembrandt Brown]

Still laughing at the premise that white progressives see racism as more of a problem than the people who it actually affects


Lol


Lions are more concerned for zebras safety than zebras


Zebras see no problem with what lions are doing to zebras

If we ignored the data and just went by your depiction of reality, we'd have 100% of ̶z̶e̶b̶r̶a̶s̶ black people agreeing racism is a major problem but that isn't the case. It's wild that there are black people who agree "Irish, Italians, Jewish and many other minorities overcame prejudice and worked their way up. Blacks should do the same without special favors." But a good number do.

I'm not saying all white people who provide good answers on these polls are sincere but I think your outright dismissal of the data might stem from the diversity of people you encounter.

You may not, but I know a lot of people like this:

 

[MT Hermit]

Dannycaceyes ain’t even American. His opinion is doubly irrelevant.

Instead of stfu and learning he stay doubling down on his fuck shit woe is me narrative. He is a lazy waste of cacness that expects sympathy when all he has 2 do is shave and tuck his shirt in and he good.