not to derail but OK we gonna fight
Future Sport one of favorite records PERIOD
that album was FIRE
Big Pun’s friends/family flame Fat Joe for absence from street naming ceremony
- Thread starter Mr. Met
- Start date
not to derail but OK we gonna fight
Future Sport one of favorite records PERIOD
that album was FIRE
I have to look for it. I remember hearing some songs but don't recall hearing the whole album.
There’s a song he did, I don’t know if it was a remix or something.
But the chorus went “Cease loves Kids and the kids love Cease”
Where is that from?
Puff was all over this...
the features on there was INSANE
(not ONE mailed in verse which kinda hurt Cease a little he was GOOD on here but he got outshined on his own album)
and the the BEATS and hooks?
he even got Jay on here....
this throwback track... was crazy RIP Whodini
Kim verse was CRAZY and she was talking crazy sh*t at the end
I have NO IDEA how this flopped
NOPE none
Fat Joe fucked up the potential social media livestreams.
They might've been banking on that drama to parlay views into some cash.
Fat Joe gotta be black balling puns son. Dude is talented he could be out here on some j cole / Kendrick Lamar type level with the right direction.
How an album with some of the best verses and hooks from Busta, Jay Z, Redman and Lil Kim
In their PRIMES
With insane production
Flop???!!!
Just don't make sense.
You could legit take off the best 6/10 beats off this album and make an undisputed classic
In 2021.
Jon that would be an ill little EP experimental project
Ok i just asked around
It was the bootleg cd era
It got leaked
And that's all she wrote
That would be an ill documentary
All the hip hop and r&b albums that got leaked in that time and whose careers got completely derailed because of it.
Don’t let Cuban Link see this post, he’d be all over that Documentary talking about how Fat Joe got the whole music industry to kill the release of his album 24K....
Man oh man looking back
Thats so foul sh*t
You would think off just respect for Biggie?
They would of made sure that Cease had a legit shot.
Cuban ALREADY being saying that
Its the latino holy grail of rap albums
The spanish illmatic
To be fair EVERYONE swears it was actually good
Similar to Cease project
Top Producers rappers singers of that era
Plus whole rap songs in Spanish
And reportedly a Pun verse
To give CL some credit?
Joe ear for beats and his connections and the budgets at that time?
Yeah its not impossible
And if you dropped that album at the exact right time?
I'm talking jlo, Enrique Iglesias, reggaeton, selena revival, rise of latinio community era...
Good promotion? The right scarface tony Montana, cuban immigrant backstory with a BX twist?
Cuban would have just needed the RIGHT lead single
probably with Fat Joe feature or Pun sample, or hot r&b singer?
Imagine Cuban JLo single? With an ill spanish guitar sample? And then an all Spanish language version?
Miami based video?
A remix?
And then a good hard BX gangsta record?
A beatnuts track?
So what that?
3 SOLID records - just 1 real pop hit and a club banger and then a mix tape joint?
Thats gold easy.
And boom no mo problems.
But that ain't happen
Aye bandito.
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Makes alotta sense now. There’s a reason why Cuban’s story was so consistent over the years. From the Smack DVD’s, the Forbez DVD’s, to the YouTube and podcast interviews, he was always in line with what was going on.
There was clearly some shifty shit going on from Fat Joe and Jellybean, enough to raise the red flags.
Joe had all the leverage back then to do what he did. He was the only business man out of a group of young ghetto kids, who knew nothing about music publishing or the music business, but where he knew and understood how contracts worked and what he could get away with.
Checkmate.
He breaks it down here too.
Roach was the publishing consultant who also helped Styles P recoup his publishing from Diddy.
I got a question no one can answer and no one ever asks but I believe is important
Where the f*ck is Macho from the Terror Squad?
That was a day one and he just disappeared
Where the f*ck is Macho from the Terror Squad?
That was a day one and he just disappeared
I will check this out
If Joe did that? That is super foul
He gonna get his punishment somehow some way
But I never really believe this stuff
Almost and I mean 90% of rappers got jerked
And basically that number goes for all music in general
So I'm not quick to condemn an artist or the acts under them on contract stuff without concrete proof
From Biggie Lox and on and on
Contracts been corrupted
Noriega had beef with Combat Jack RIP for years over contracts
Looking back we never enough stories of artists blaming the REAL people in charge.
I believe Pistol Pete said he was kicked out of Terror Squad
I would appreciate you sending me that if you ever come across it again. I been crazy curious for years about that.
I feel it.
Joe would most likely deny it and give you the “talk to my lawyer” response which is expected, but it makes perfect sense why them streets were waiting on him and he never showed.
If life taught me anything, it’s that the truth don’t run. It don’t avoid, it don’t detract, it don’t deflect..
And you’re right, contractual shit happens all the time in the game, but it’s slightly different when the estate of the contract in question is homeless and can’t fend for themselves, when those monies owed are there and being redirected someplace else.
The simple fact we talking bout this is shiesty enough.
You ain't say one lie
But it's complicated with the widow writing books making documentary interviews talking about Pun abusive horrible behavior and accusing EVERYONE of being complicit
Them asking for help?
Also I hear you about Truth
But Joe been crazy consistent too about his version.
I saw THIS!!!!
that not in existence no more line!!!!!
I still have no idea what that REALLY means.
But I know.
I still want real details
I get that Liza’s role in this may have soured the whole situation and ok, it’s not cordial by any means, what with her pumping out tell all’s and slandering the man every chance she gets, but realistically speaking, she could slander Joe til the end of the world and it still wouldn’t mean she wasn’t entitled to Pun’s estate. She could hold the biggest grudge on planet earth til she’s blue in the face, but legally speaking, what’s her is hers and it’s looking like Joe made sure that wasn’t the case.
I honestly think Joe could put this all to bed with some actual receipts. The opposition, Geddy Rem, Seis, Cuban, Prospect, Pete, Liza, Chris Rivers and the whole camp have been consistent in their stories, whether that’s being coy about the whole thing or just being flat out honest .. it’s all stacked up with receipts on their end.
I think it’s time for Joey Crack to shed some light on the inner workings of what really went down there and speaking strictly from a business standpoint, that would probably never happen. Him being active in this rap game ensures that he’ll never have to bring it up cause it would fuck with his money.
Man the amount of dudes who made it to the top by being flat out shifty snakes is unreal at times, and if Crack is up there, I’m not gonna flat out accuse him, but I do have some burning questions cause some things aren’t adding up.
You are absolutely correct.
Abuse or not IF she is owed she should get it period
but remember we were all so mad at Puff but then we learned it was BIG that sold away all his rights with his eyes wide open
BIG wanted the money NOW
Puff KNEW what it was but a grown man made a deal.
But then you heard the folk shouting...
BIG was your brother, what about Biggie's kids and his mother...
See? Even WITH receipts folks gonna STILL be mad
Like you said - are we REALLY gonna feel "better" if it is revealed Pun did the same thing?
Cause all of sudden it wont be business anymore..
its gonna be he was your TWIN f*ck the contracts
But it can't BE THAT.
It can't be what you WANT to be
AFTER THE FACT.
I aint really taking sides here I AGREE with you
show receipts.
But if you think Joe showing receipts is REALLY gonna settle this?
i disagree with you there fam.
Even if Joe gave her 2 million NOW? On some like make PEACE vibe?
she PROBABLY gonna STILL be mad and everyone else will be too.
I hear what you saying and yea, the Big Puff ordeal was spot on, but Puff never stopped Big from doing other things. Just like Hov let X go to do greater things outside Def Jam and not stand in the way, Puff did that for Big, but I feel like there would still be salt there from Cuban because Joey shelved tf outta him and boxed him into a corner he could never get out of. If we no longer fuck with each other, it’s cool. Shit happens ... but to not allow that man to eat further and continue his career .. that seems extra. Geddy once said that “I told Joei was leaving Terri Squad and his response was, ‘cool, just don’t use the name..” and left it at that.
2 mil to the family is a dope peace gesture and for Liza may or may not clear up some things, idk, but Cuban and the rest will prolly still stay salty regarded since it seems like the more we look under the rug, the more we see how Joe propelled himself on their shoulders and never looked back.
It’s almost more than just the money at that point.
Maybe this is just a fracture that’s too far removed.
But that's my point - its not about money AT ALL
if they REALLY wanted PEACE
They wanted closure?
They would l STOP bringing it up.
Nobody on EITHER side is gonna change the public's perspective either way.
Like the ORIGINAL intent of this thread.
Why are THEY at basically a funeral with a score card on THEY lap tallying who is there or not?
THAT is THIER focus?
That aint about peace or closure or has ANYTHING to do with the dead.
So of course when THEY start accusing someone ELSE of being shady a thief and petty etc
I aint gonna take ANYTHING they say serious
Podcasts interviews and youtube clips aint gonna exactly HELP.
We will NEVER know the truth about Cuban Link situation
because here is the issue in 2021?
No one can really blackball you.
just RELEASE the music. Once its out?? then its out.
If you REALLY as dope as you say?
DO IT Cuban.. stop talking. RAP
Success is the best revenge and THAT will sway way more hearts and minds then all this tough talk into their phones.
And I'm talking to ALL involved.
But to be as disingenuous as to imply if Fat joe came to that event with a huge crowds and ALL those cameras and press there
that they would NOT have cased a scene?
HA!!!
That alone makes me doubt ANYTHING they would EVER say about ANYTHING!
Its not about MONEY like you said
And its really sad that the only currency they have in abundance and KEEP trading in is PAIN.
That aint honoring Pun at all.
Here's my problem with Joe story, he said Pun made millions and millions of dollars and he didn't make a dime off Pun right? How? He was executive producer of the album, it was thru Terror Squad/Loud Records. If he made millions you profited off it as well. He also said he had no idea how Pun was spending his millions. GTFOH, ya'll were always together. He's the cash cow. Joe owned some portion of Puns publishing as well, its common label bullshit. So he can kill all that talk. Plus it's just strange how he made millions(Joe's words) off a platinum album, when the label gets paid 1st, then the boutique label, etc b4 the artist does. So Joe isn't 100% truthful but if Liza blew the bag after Pun died then she needs to take responsibility too, cuz honestly I've never seen her take any.
I wouldn't say he's a slept on MC. I think he just came out at the wrong time and due to circumstances just didn't get a chance to make his own name.
Like I said earlier, he was nice but he just couldn't get out the Fat Joe/Big Pun shadow.
Had he came out out well after Pun or Joe, he may have had some success, but I honestly think he peaked with the first Terror Squad album.
Nothing he released since was as good or better. Pun was probably writing Cuban's shit as much as he was writing Fat Joe's shit too.
OK damn when you put like THAT?
Joe is convicted!
I always thought Joe was being a tad facetious here...
not LITERAL.
Capital Punishment apparently went DOUBLE platinum
for LOUD back then
that is an OUTSTANDING number
He ad the JLo feature, Beatnuts record...
actually he was doing a TON of features and none of them flopped.
then AFTER he dies they released Yeah Baby and Endangered Species plus a greatest hits.
So there was MONEY being made
Big Pun's Gone but His Career Is Going Strong
With Tupac Shakur's fourth posthumous album, "Until the End of Time," entering the national sales chart at No. 1 last week, and another double album of his work expected in November, it's more clear than ever that death is no deterrent to selling records.
www.latimes.com
Big Pun discography - Wikipedia
Big Punisher
Big Punisher
I don;t know.
I REFUSE to believe his widow got NOTHING like she saying
so if THAT is still her position
just off that?
I'm with Joe until proven otherwise.
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Big Pun’s Gone but His Career Is Going Strong
By SOREN BAKER
APRIL 8, 2001 12 AM PT
SOREN BAKER IS A REGULAR CONTRIBUTOR TO CALENDAR
With Tupac Shakur’s fourth posthumous album, “Until the End of Time,” entering the national sales chart at No. 1 last week, and another double album of his work expected in November, it’s more clear than ever that death is no deterrent to selling records.
In fact, with hip-hop suffering the loss of more stars in the prime of their careers than other pop music genres in recent years, marketing the music of deceased rappers has become a grimly regular task for record labels. The Notorious B.I.G., Big L, Eazy-E and Mausberg are some of the other hip-hop artists who have had albums issued after their deaths.
Interscope, which handles Shakur in association with Amaru Records, has the advantage of access to more than 150 unreleased songs he left behind when he was killed by unknown assailants in Las Vegas in 1996. The rapper, who recorded under his 2Pac moniker, had also filmed many videos before his death, and his image remains alive in such movies as “Poetic Justice,” 'Juice” and “Gridlock’d.”
The late Big Punisher did not record nearly as prolifically as Shakur, but he is the latest due for a big posthumous push. Last week, Loud Records released the second album to come out since the Bronx-based rapper died in February 2000 of heart failure. “Endangered Species” will have to compete with the Eminems, Dr. Dres, Nellys and OutKasts of the world, all of whom are able to tour, conduct interviews and do the other work of promoting an album.
‘It’s harder to promote and work him because we don’t have a lot of live footage,” says Steve Rifkind, Loud’s chief executive. “We’re doing animation and will use whatever B-roll [existing taped interviews] we have.”
The label will issue an animated video for the collection’s first single, “How We Roll.” Plans for the other two singles Loud wants to release in support of the album have yet to be finalized.
In part to compensate for the shortage of promotional tools, Loud decided to include all of the album’s lyrics in the CD booklet-a rarity for a rap release. The idea is to emphasize one of Pun’s biggest assets-his remarkable ability to string together loads of words without sounding jumbled.
“This album is a tribute to him, but it’s also to show people how lyrical he was,” says Sean Cane, director of A&R; for Loud and co-executive producer of “Endangered Species.” 'His flow was really intricate, which is why we’ve got all of the lyrics written out. Pun was one of the best. You’ll really feel that after you get this album.”
Big Pun’s first posthumous album, 2000’s “Yeeeah Baby,” which sold 800,000 copies, was nearly completed when the rapper (whose real name was Christopher Rios) died. “Endangered Species,” on the other hand, features a number of collaborations between Pun and top-tier guests that appeared as B-sides or as tracks on other artists’ albums. There are also six unreleased songs.
Like the Notorious B.I.G.'s posthumous “Born Again,” which included several previously available songs and had guest appearances by Eminem, the Cash Money Millionaires and others, “Endangered Species” benefits from appearances by some of Big Pun’s admirers. Noreaga and Fat Joe deliver testimonials on the album, while Swizz Beatz, Rodney Jerkins and Buckwild are among those whose production prowess shines on the new collection.
‘We got love from most people,” Cane says. “Pun had a lot of fans in the industry and people that really liked him as more than just a rapper. People were willing to put in what they could.”
Pun, unlike most rappers, was known as a comedian and prankster. His humor was also evident in his videos, which often poked fun at his obesity and highlighted his charm.
It was his recordings, of course, that earned him the most respect. Whether rapping about his affinity for women of all nationalities on “Still Not a Player” with R&B; singer Joe or ripping through a brutal display of braggadocio on “Fire Water” with Fat Joe, Armageddon and Raekwon, Big Pun was one of the few hip-hop acts who was respected for both his radio songs and his street selections.
“He represents the artists who do both the commercial and the hard-core,” Cane says. “There have only been a few guys that could do the hard-core, underground record and then the club records. It’s a theme of the album that many people can’t do it, and it’s also what he wanted to call his second album before he went with “Yeeeah Baby.” 'This is a genuine album that came from him.”
The six new tracks on “Endangered Species” are among the last of his unreleased songs, according to Loud Records’ Rifkind.
“If someone finds 50 more songs of his, we’d put them out if they were hits,” he says. “But this is really the only album that we’re going to put out. These are records that just hadn’t gotten cleared [when he died], but we’re not going to be putting out an album every 18 months or every two years. We’re not going to ruin his legacy. Pun was a friend.”
By SOREN BAKER
APRIL 8, 2001 12 AM PT
SOREN BAKER IS A REGULAR CONTRIBUTOR TO CALENDAR
With Tupac Shakur’s fourth posthumous album, “Until the End of Time,” entering the national sales chart at No. 1 last week, and another double album of his work expected in November, it’s more clear than ever that death is no deterrent to selling records.
In fact, with hip-hop suffering the loss of more stars in the prime of their careers than other pop music genres in recent years, marketing the music of deceased rappers has become a grimly regular task for record labels. The Notorious B.I.G., Big L, Eazy-E and Mausberg are some of the other hip-hop artists who have had albums issued after their deaths.
Interscope, which handles Shakur in association with Amaru Records, has the advantage of access to more than 150 unreleased songs he left behind when he was killed by unknown assailants in Las Vegas in 1996. The rapper, who recorded under his 2Pac moniker, had also filmed many videos before his death, and his image remains alive in such movies as “Poetic Justice,” 'Juice” and “Gridlock’d.”
The late Big Punisher did not record nearly as prolifically as Shakur, but he is the latest due for a big posthumous push. Last week, Loud Records released the second album to come out since the Bronx-based rapper died in February 2000 of heart failure. “Endangered Species” will have to compete with the Eminems, Dr. Dres, Nellys and OutKasts of the world, all of whom are able to tour, conduct interviews and do the other work of promoting an album.
‘It’s harder to promote and work him because we don’t have a lot of live footage,” says Steve Rifkind, Loud’s chief executive. “We’re doing animation and will use whatever B-roll [existing taped interviews] we have.”
The label will issue an animated video for the collection’s first single, “How We Roll.” Plans for the other two singles Loud wants to release in support of the album have yet to be finalized.
In part to compensate for the shortage of promotional tools, Loud decided to include all of the album’s lyrics in the CD booklet-a rarity for a rap release. The idea is to emphasize one of Pun’s biggest assets-his remarkable ability to string together loads of words without sounding jumbled.
“This album is a tribute to him, but it’s also to show people how lyrical he was,” says Sean Cane, director of A&R; for Loud and co-executive producer of “Endangered Species.” 'His flow was really intricate, which is why we’ve got all of the lyrics written out. Pun was one of the best. You’ll really feel that after you get this album.”
Big Pun’s first posthumous album, 2000’s “Yeeeah Baby,” which sold 800,000 copies, was nearly completed when the rapper (whose real name was Christopher Rios) died. “Endangered Species,” on the other hand, features a number of collaborations between Pun and top-tier guests that appeared as B-sides or as tracks on other artists’ albums. There are also six unreleased songs.
Like the Notorious B.I.G.'s posthumous “Born Again,” which included several previously available songs and had guest appearances by Eminem, the Cash Money Millionaires and others, “Endangered Species” benefits from appearances by some of Big Pun’s admirers. Noreaga and Fat Joe deliver testimonials on the album, while Swizz Beatz, Rodney Jerkins and Buckwild are among those whose production prowess shines on the new collection.
‘We got love from most people,” Cane says. “Pun had a lot of fans in the industry and people that really liked him as more than just a rapper. People were willing to put in what they could.”
Pun, unlike most rappers, was known as a comedian and prankster. His humor was also evident in his videos, which often poked fun at his obesity and highlighted his charm.
It was his recordings, of course, that earned him the most respect. Whether rapping about his affinity for women of all nationalities on “Still Not a Player” with R&B; singer Joe or ripping through a brutal display of braggadocio on “Fire Water” with Fat Joe, Armageddon and Raekwon, Big Pun was one of the few hip-hop acts who was respected for both his radio songs and his street selections.
“He represents the artists who do both the commercial and the hard-core,” Cane says. “There have only been a few guys that could do the hard-core, underground record and then the club records. It’s a theme of the album that many people can’t do it, and it’s also what he wanted to call his second album before he went with “Yeeeah Baby.” 'This is a genuine album that came from him.”
The six new tracks on “Endangered Species” are among the last of his unreleased songs, according to Loud Records’ Rifkind.
“If someone finds 50 more songs of his, we’d put them out if they were hits,” he says. “But this is really the only album that we’re going to put out. These are records that just hadn’t gotten cleared [when he died], but we’re not going to be putting out an album every 18 months or every two years. We’re not going to ruin his legacy. Pun was a friend.”
I can see this take but let’s not get it twisted ...
For Liza and the fam, it’s DEF about getting that paper. There’s no question there. The slander was icing on the cake, which if true, is deserved but first comes what’s owed to the estate.
Now for Cuban, I don’t think that paper matters. Like you said, if he wants to shine, just rap. You got the skill to make records so go do that. I think he’d be fine in that regard. I think for him it’s more about the disrespect he felt. I’d take that “welcome back to the hood..” with a grain of salt. He prolly got other intentions. We’ll never know
They’re all lumped in together in their disdain for Joey, but each have their own intentions on what they wanna move forward with if that makes sense.
Some want that paper, others want respect, others want nothing.. it’s a mixed bag but it’s unequivocal that each of em hold some kinda ill will towards dude.